Quote of the Day: Martin Roscheisen, CEO of Nanosolar, "Biofuels don't cut it"
by Michael Graham Richard, Gatineau, Canada on 08.20.08
"This is one of my favorite charts: A comparison of the distance a car can drive based on either of the following forms of energy, each produced on 100m x 100m of land (2.5 acres). How come that biofuel does not really cut it? Electric cars are about four times more energy efficient than fuel based cars, no matter whether they are based on biofuel or other fuel. This is because any fuel engine mostly creates heat and thus wastes the majority of the available energy units. Combine this with plants not being very efficient solar energy harvesters relative to semiconductor based solar electricity, and the result is this huge difference."
"I for one have vowed that the Prius I bought six years ago will have been the last fuel powered car I’d buy in my life. Presently, it is baking in the sun all day while I’m at work. My future all-electric car would charge up while idling under a solar carport." Source: Nanosolar Blog
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The difference probably would be lower if the panels weren't close to the car that needs to be charged, but even with more transmission losses, it's clear that PV beats biofuels.
Right on. I can't wait to plug my car. Even if it's with a semi-dirty grid, it would still be better and get better with time.
This wasn't mentioned, but I assume that the analysis assumes no gasoline is used. Plug-in hybrids can still burn gas. The amount of land used for oil extraction is not easily quantified.
Great visual representation of the difference in energy produced.
A shame they didnt include ethanol from cane sugar as produced in Brazil. My understanding is that its 5-6+ times better than corn biogas? Even so, it would still be only a fraction of the energy from PV :)
I doubt it would look so good for PV up here in rainy old Seattle, plus the yield for all the crops might be higher than in more southern climes where the PV would be high, and the crop yields lower.
True Liam, but even so, for the vast majority of drivers, even a 40 mile per day electric range would cover the vast majority of miles driven. I'd think the fossil fuels used for the rest of the miles driven would be as low as or less than the fossil fuels used to grow, process, and ship all that biofuel.
@ Anon
Transmission losses last year in the USA were 7%. Using HVDC electrical losses are 5% per 1000 (thousand) miles, so CSP and PV in the SW and wind in the midwest wind corridor can essentially power the entire USA, with slight overbuild to compensate for losses.
Everyone who reads this blog should download David MacKay's book at withouthotair.com and read the whole thing. If you're not sci/engr, just skim all the math and go to the main points. (I get the feeling not too many sci/engr's read this blog, which is sad.) In his final analysis, biofuel ends up being "use wood for heating where it makes sense". He gets to that point by *doing_the_math*, like the above person does. He does look slightly ahead at future technological improvements, but he doesn't let himself bet the farm on them (just half the farm).
To sum up the book, he notes that *all* the energy we use (including transport and heating) is about 4 times current electricity production. He notes that with only moderate NIMBY and ecological impact, renewables could conceivably put out only as much energy as our current electrical production. To replace our transport and heating needs would require more buildout than we are prepared for, and/or importation of power from desert countries (maybe not so much for the US), and/or *gasp* nuclear.
He says to increase efficiency, we need to switch all heating and cooling over to new tech, and move all energy transport and usage to electricity. This would decrease our total energy consumption to, say, 3 times our current electricity production, meaning we only have to triple the current electrical production. In all his scenarios he is forced to dismiss biofuels for said massive electrical production because of the pitiful area-to-energy-per-year ratio, versus other options.
Sadly, this is another narrow, misleading view designed to shock and awe by a biofuel competitor. This completely ignores reality and time.
Biofuels will be part of the solution for some time to come. No one energy source is the complete solution.
Your average Joe is not going to replace their internal combustion engine cars overnight or even in the next decade. Also, try buying a plug in today.. they dont exist. The batteries dont exist in volume either.
Add to this the build out in generation and battery manufacture required for this utopian vision, and you will see that internal combustion engines will be arround for a long time yet.
It is time to get over this rubbish and start accepting biofuels will be around for some time. Biofuels exist today, and make a difference, so we should be promoting their use, not consantly knocking them.
JJ, I think it depends how you take it. I don't think that saying that solar electric is better means that biofuels have no place.
But in the long run, the only biofuels that will make it are probably based on algae...
@JJ: I think the point is not that biofuels are worthless. I think it's that you get more bang for your buck with photovoltaics. So if you're going to invest, PVs are the way to go.
But even the first generation of plug-in hybrids will have internal-combustion engines. The GM Volt for example will have an internal combustion engine to generate electricity for the electric motors. It's expected to get around 50mpg using that scheme. It would seem that biofuels would fit very well into that scenario.
It's also likely, barring any kind of super battery breakthrough, that 2nd, 3rd and 4th generation plug-in electric cars will retain that internal combustion engine.
Plus, there doesn't seem to be a great solution for semi trucks with regard to plug-in. So I see biofuels being very useful there as well.