T. Boone Pickens Talks Natural Gas, Energy Independence, Peak Oil and Swift Boating with Katie Couric
by Matthew McDermott, Brooklyn, NY on 07.15.08
Last week T. Boone Pickens unveiled his plan to increase U.S. renewable energy and reduce dependence on foreign oil by expanding the nation’s wind energy portfolio and using natural gas to power cars.
In this 12-minute video clip from last week Katie Couric asks Pickens more about his plan, plus his past political activities with the Swift Boat Veterans and their campaign against former presidential nominee John Kerry. Be forewarned: At the start of the clip you have to sit through a 30-second ad. The one which preceeded the clip the first time I watched it was for ExxonMobil. I laughed at that juxtaposition.
It’s TV news, so even in this extended interview, don’t expect any really in-depth questioning of Pickens’ responses. For those that don’t want to watch the whole clip, here are some of the energy-related highlights:
Do we have the infrastructure and cars to actually make a switch to natural gas?
Not completely...GM has 25 cars they built for natural gas. All of them are foreign... South America, Europe. None are for the United States. You could just as easily build them here as you could there. So cars can be made available pretty quick. You’re gonna focus on the bigger equipment though...medium and heavy duty trucks and buses. ... There are 8 million vehicles in the world today that run on natural gas. ... If natural gas went for transportation fuel it would reduce our imports [of oil] by 38%, which would save us $300 billion a year in this country.
As many people have said, and I second, it’s probably better to use natural gas in more efficient ways than as a transport fuel. Ultimately natural gas reserves will exhaust themselves as well, both in the United States and abroad. As that happens a natural gas dependency could just replace our current oil dependency.
A better solution would be to have electric powered vehicles, better public transportation infrastructure to reduce private motor vehicle demand, civic infrastructure changes so daily commutes can be made shorter and use natural gas to replace electricity generated currently by coal. Part of the problem with U.S. transportation energy usage is the structure of the system itself, in addition to the fuel that powers it.
Are you trying to become the Al Gore of energy independence?
I am more focused, not on green, I am focused more on the $700 billion going out of the country. I’m not opposed to any...Al, I don’t think he’s for drilling in the offshore...I’m for doing anything we can to reduce that dependency.
Whatever his motivations—patriotism or environmentalism—the result of Pickens investment in wind will be more renewable energy, which is a good thing. Even if the natural gas portion of the plan isn’t great. However the amount of oil in ANWR and the offshore areas that are off limits will do little to further US energy independence for very long. Gaining a few more years worth of oil at the cost of potential further environmental degradation is a distraction from the greater changes that need to happen in US energy supply.
Why do you think oil is so high?
Because we peaked on oil production. 85 million barrels a day is what the world produces and you have a demand of 86.4 ... Consequently you’re bidding for the marginal barrel. And when you're competing against China, India and all the developing countries, they bid the price up.
Even though Pickens isn’t the first former oil man to publicly talk about peak oil as a current reality, it still amazes me when I hear it on television. I just wish there was a bit more probing into this question. The consequences are so profound, and even though many people aren’t aware of the issue, they easily grasp the problem once the concept is explained and the production numbers given. It’s high time the peak oil discussion becomes as commonplace as climate change.
The Pickens Plan
Wind Power to Displace Natural Gas for Electricity, Natural Gas to Power Cars: The Pickens Plan
The Pickens Plan, Part Two: Partial Deconstruction
T. Boone Pickens
T. Boone Pickens Gets Into The Texas Wind: 4,000 Megawatts Worth
T. Boone Pickens Rides the Wind
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- Young People, Energy Independence is Your Problem, Not My Problem: T. Boone Pickens
- It's Not Easy Being Afghanistan's First Wind Farm
- California Voters Reject Well Meaning But Poorly Drafted Renewable Energy Ballot Initiatives





















I agree, it would be nicer to replace coal with natural gas than to replace oil with natural gas, but methane is a less carbon intensive fuel than any other fossil fuel, so it is a net gain regardless. Of course, I'd still prefer a PHEV than an all-methane car. Plus, once methane cars are around and common, we have another possibility. We can build cars that, rather than burning methane in an ICE, crack methane for hydrogen and use a fuel cell. This will yield greater efficiency without requiring dedicated hydrogen infrastructure. There are a number of directions to go from there, but it seems like a reasonable step.
Keep in mind, also, that we really haven't reached peak methane. There are still terratons of the stuff locked up in the world's ice, and it may become all too easy to get to as that ice starts melting. In the worst case scenario, we may have to burn the stuff and turn it into CO2, a less potent greenhouse gas, just to prevent a total climate catastrophe.
Also, regardless of what we may ask for, we aren't going to see coal replaced with methane on the grid, because coal is still cheaper. Until we change that fact, either through technology, through policy, or through grassroots support/action/demand, coal isn't going anywhere.
TBP is a one horse show. If you turn a big segment of the US cara fleet over to natural gas without bringing in massive amounts of LNG at ports all around the nation, two things will happen in short order.
People who heat their homes with natural gas will be paying a lot more. And the Gulf Coast chemical industry which is highly dependent on natural gas as both a feedstock and energy source ,will have much higher operating costs. The result will be a consortium of public and private interests opposed.
With electric vehicles, the fleet is blind to the ultiimate energy source and you have more flexibility as Matt points out.
Too bad we are so attuned to celebrity interviewers who unfailingly are able to sidestep such issues in their work.
Katie Couric is a hack. What kind of interview was this? People are interested in newer, better, and cheaper sources of energy - not some B.S. about financial incentives and politics. Of course TBP is going to make money, why would he bother otherwise?
There's the only way you are going to get people to adopt "green" products: saving money and it isn't a bother to their lifestyle. Once you get those two issues solved, it's a pure cakewalk from then on.
Check it yo,
I'm a journeyman carpenter who has actually been recycling and resourcing better uses of our wood products for years just because I grew up in the Northwest.
Now my family has a company that produces exclusive "green products" and especially target insect pests that plague our trees in the entire United States.
To see that for yourself, just log onto AMAZ-ZING-BLU.COM, click onto [ info in your state ] and you will see a real life tree hugging carpenter at work. I don't live in a glass house, I live in a wooden one, and basically I am a trees worst nightmare, however, my goals are to replenish as we go along, and other scientific break thru's, as well as go after the real continuing dilemma of problem pest insects.
As for the [ weblog ], yeah I'm really doing my part, and it's time that people really research the offshore oil rigs to see if only 1% of all ocean oil is due to off shore oil rigs. My friends are surfers and I respect them for all their dedication and I want to know first hand from my people the Zentreprenuers instead of some media glib on the Prez's payroll.
Basically here on planet reality, in the world of actuality, it's time for responsibility instead of just shouting dracticity while living in a glass house.
later dudes & dudettes....
I think it is a good idea to build the wind turbines.
The rest of his plan only makes him rich, but does little for the environment.
Why wasn't he thinking about this in the 1970s when people were standing in line at the gas stations because there wasn't enough gas for everyone? Remember the assigned days where odd number plates could get gas on certain days & even numbered plates could get gas on other days?
I find it ironic that I had a 4-cylinder Japanese car in 1979 that got over 40 miles per gallon. Now it's difficult to find a 4-cylinder car that will even get 30 miles per gallon. Even the hybrids aren't that great on mileage.
The bigger issue with his proposal on natural gas in the infrastructure challenges to switching to any option other than gas or electric vehicles. GM, Ford, Chrysler all buiilt flex vehicles on the theory of E85 becoming a replacement for gas. Remember GM's "Go Yellow" campaign?
Problem is there were only a handful of pumps that could handle E85. It became apparent that it was cost prohibitive to install thousands of new pumps. So all these flex vehicles were built with no where to get E85.
Natural gas would present the same problems in replacing the refueling stations. TBP talks about how all the big auto companies make natural gas vehicles now, but he doesn't address how to address the refueling issue. Sure mass transit could make the switch, but that is not enough to get is wedge.
T. Pickens funding of the Swift Boat attacks on John Kerry (doing his part to give us 4 more years of Bush) did more to enslave us to oil than any Johnny-come-lately investment in solar will ever be able to atone for. He may have a great P.R. firm but until he accomplishes more good than the evil he has engendered I'll keep thinking of him as one of the bad guys.
I agree too that wind power is good LNG not.
He smell the rat in the oil, so he look for other source of money.
On the other note: He is in total denial about Vietnam. Looking on he's age even if you show him the absolute proof with witness, he will not change his mind. Totally lost case.
I don't have any problem with his ideas and have even less of a problem with the idea that his plan and the promotion of it will make him money. Fact is, we need to stop thinking of renewable/green energy and things relating to as a charity. Why does profit lessen the substance of his plan? Until there are people like Pickens profiting from green energy it will never become mainstream.
It's unlikely that electric vehicles will be viable for long-range shipping and large vehicles in our lifetime. Pickens is right in his assessment that natural gas is ideal for those vehicles. If renewable electricity sources replace the use of natural gas in homes, business, and industry, it can be used in transportation in large vehicles without a sizable increase in demand. That's clean fuel for a transportation sector that electric cars can't help.
Will we eventually run out of natural gas? Yes. But in the meantime we have a clean burning fuel to use while we prepare for that time by building an electric infrastructure for transport... as long as we don't become complacent and think the natural gas will last forever.
Mark my words, either 2009 or 2010 will be the year of the Electrical car.
As for Pickens' plan: While natural gas is cheap, it will cost billions to build a fueling infrastructure. And like oil, natural gas is a finite resource. Electric cars on the other hand can be fueled by electricity via any source.
Any home with an outside electrical outlet is potentially a "refueling station" with a electric car. Moreover, the technology behind electric cars has advanced to the point of it matching the ICE experience.
"I just think he had better alternatives to offer..." give me a break... The only policy on energy that Bush supports is oil. I was at a loss for words as he tried so hard to not offend others. On a side note, this guy supports off-shore drilling and other money making schemes that as John said, make him rich and the environment poor.
PHEV vehicles are the only way to go. The downside to them right now is that they don't get the best range and the ones that do are in most cases expensive.
While I agree that this is not the most environmental idea, we need to re-balance our mono-culture of transport fuels. Any stock market adviser will tell you to diversify to ensure a stable market value. The same rule applies here. The more energy sources used to produce a product, or fuel our cars, the less likely the change in any one fuel source will have an impact on over all transportation costs. Competition will keep the vendors improving CNG cars while others will improve electric cars.
We just don't have the opportunity to make those choices because we are locked into one fuel distribution and automobile choice.
It is worth noting, however, that CNG cars typically tend to have higher greenhouse gas emissions than hybrids (due to the high methane content). In a typical year of driving the Honda Civic GX (the Honda's CNG car that the EPA called the "cleanest internal combustion engine on Earth") emits 30 percent more greenhouse gases than the Civic hybrid in a typical year of driving (http://www.hybridcars.com/compressed-natural-gas/overview.html)
http://www.sierraclub.org/wildlegacy/blog/
Why did the interviewer keep asking him if it was ok to make money out of this venture??? That is what it is all about. Wind energy is a great business, it is clear and is pretty much reliable, it doesn't involve foreign states and terrorism.
I thought he was a good guy until I heard about the swift boat rubbish.
I think Pickens is on the right track. If we use the same gas as we use in our house, the infrastructure is already in place. We already have a gas line going to our house for our furnace.
All we would need to do is put in a special pump and we could fill our cars at our house. The oil companies would be willing to put in a couple of pumps at their filling stations because you would be buying their natural gas. This would be for motorists that are traveling or don't have a private pump.
I am appalled every time I see a PICKENS ad - There is no free lunch - Drive less slow down lighter vehicle good maintenance park snowmobiles ski boats fly less etc!
These are the only FAST TRACK measures to stabilize oil...
Natural Gas has many problems for use as a vehicle fuel - less BTU = LESS POWER - no easy way to convert vehicles - more weight in fuel tanks - safety issues - transport/storage issues - economic issues etc.
The only thing he says that is good is we are 30 years late in developing wind and solar...
Ray
Pickens plan is a joke! Instead of you being enslaved to foreign oil he wants you to be enslaved to American domestic oil! Natural gas is a fossil fuel. If Mr Pickens has suddenly gone green he would be spending his billions on battery development, or solar power for vehicles. He wants to put up wind turbines so you will forget about the billions he and cronies in the natural gas industry will be making off you every time you fill up your car! He is a snake in the grass just like Al Gore. Hypocrites!! Their only concern for the planet is how quick they can fill their wallets! Wake up America!!!!!!!!!!!!! Chewy!