Maybe instead of blaming the cars we should blame those parents that raised those kids into adults without ever teaching them to look both ways before crossing a street. But alas, people in general want to point a finger at someone else, even a good natured treehugger sometimes ;) , and not look at themselves as the culprit of their own dire situation.

I say we work tweels into electric and hybrid cars to generate a sound naturally and without additional parts. In addition to simplifying wheels this would also only generate sound at I think 30+ mph so in neighborhoods or parking lots there'd generally be little sound where highways or other roadways would be whistling pretty constantly with the traffic flow.

I would have chosen the 'no' option if only because bells should be reserved for sneaky cats and irritating children. Not to mention, the adage, "I will be there with bells on" would become overused and trite. However, after listening for my brother's Prius to turn on I did realize that as an avid bike rider I feared for my life.

Since I have avoided too many near death experiences against cars that I can hear, I was concerned about how many more I might have only nearly avoid with cars that i cannot hear.

Thus far my luck has held out against these silent terrors of the roadways but my question is, could we just make them squeak a little or add a speaker that emits a low level "car noise"?

Well, I'm finely qualified to answer this, and a two year Prius 2006 owner driving in city / suburbs of Montreal.

Casualties so far:
- two scared individuals, one dent & scratch on Prius.

__One cyclist did a U-turn w/o looking and crashed into me as I was nearing a stop sign, in a 30km/h zone.
I saw the possibility of it happening, stopped fully before the stop sign, and he rolled into at about walking speed, and body rolled into the hood. The Prius low front profile actually helped the cyclist. Not even a bruise on him.
He was really scared, and in his fifties too. Not a kid.

My Prius suffered a small dent & scratch, something I can live with.

__One sixty-ish lady, walking on the sidewalk. Quiet Sunday on a small street. Again, coasting to a stop sign.
W/o looking, she impulsively decides to walk into the street before the stop sign, not at the stop sign.
Again, I foresaw the even, was stopped.
She walked into the car.

So all those people that voted against - you're obviously not hybrid drivers, or using the Civic Hybrid that it's motor never turns off.

I want to install a clicker sound with a small outdoor speaker, directed forward.

Even coming close to hitting a kid or a teenager?
Not once! They always check. It's the adults the problem. I haven't written about the dozen "close calls" were adults were freaked out that I was behind them or besides them.

Last year I wanted to put a small MP3 player w/speaker, set to loop, playing Crazy Frog's Formula 1 imitation.
Well, summer + Montreal + June (F1 Grand Prix) but refrained. Must be my age.

I will install a clicker / chirper though. Simple enough of a circuit.

Not a noise maker, but perhaps an electronic radio-signalled sensor the blind person wears that picks up a univeral signal emitted by all EVs.
As an aside; just how much quieter is an EV (still with tire noise, motor hum, etc) than any other modern ICE vehicle at low speeds? They're both pretty quiet but neither is truly silent. At higher speeds, they're both easily heard by everyone.

As a former Prius Driver I qualify to speak up on this.

I think its purely silly to install continuous noise makers on any vehicle... I have had a few instances of people being spooked that I was there, but it was ALWAYS at low speeds when the engine was off and rolling noise was low.

Each time I have had someone come into my path, it has been highly predictable.

I would much rather have a low volume horn... just something I can use to alert walkers in parking lots and the odd cyclist, without scaring the pants off them.

no,no,no,no,no....

as an every day bike commuter, i can say without question that this is a non-issue. a prius makes just as much 'road noise' as other cars in its size/weight class. tire noise is aa large part of the equation.. these guys would be better off spending taking some noise data instead of solving problems that don't exist.

get outta your cars and get some perspective.

What about the idea of simply separating vehicular and pedestrian traffic?
Cars on one level, people and bikes on another.
"Loudening" hybrids is pretty silly.

OK enough of this garbage already.

I want to see a SCIENTIFIC study on the noise created by hybrids, EVs, and similar sized ICE compacts. Do the tests in various neighborhood and city locations, parking lots, at various times of day.

Since some friends and I actually did our own little study with a digital decibel meter and a couple of cars vs a Prius in electric mode, I'm pretty confident a real study would show this is total and complete nonsense.

But of course, repeat a myth enough times and it will never die.

Geez, most of these comments are as I predicted, non-hybrid drivers.

At 30km/h in EV mode, my car emits about the same amount of noise as a mountain bike on pavement.

Bikes hitting pedestrians is quite common on roads, and hurt people.

However, I still think my car should emit some noise when in EV mode, clicker or white noise.

I voted on #1, because a) it's a lot harder to avoid hitting someone when you're moving faster and b) it's a lot harder to avoid hitting someone when you're bigger. It's alright to say bicylists can avoid hitting someone, but they're smaller and slower moving.

If hybrids not making enough noise to be heard by peds, cyclists, and blind folk is a problem, the simplest solution is to make the cars annouce their presence in some way. Building different levels for peds and cars is a waste of money, using complicated tech to do something with such a simple solution is ridiculous.

The best and most eco-smart solutions, in casr y'all hadn't noticed, are usually the simplest ones.

As a blind person, I find the idea of silent cars dangerous, even at relatively low speeds, which complicate things more by having less air and tire noise. Its not just a matter of jumping out of the way if you can't see where you're jumping at the last possible second. Does that sound safe to anyone?

If there's a way to give the cars a sound, perhaps one the driver is shielded from, or high pitched enough that it's non-obtrustive to people, but (guide) dogs or inexpensive electronic equipment can detect, then I'm in.

I would have selected the "no" option, except I believe it is pedestrians' responsibility not to get hit by cars. Look before crossing, dum dums!

I hate to say it, but these things are too quiet. I got clipped while walking by an inattentive Prius driver in a parking ramp. The car made no perceivable noise when it was pulling out of a parking spot. Something that would have indicated a running vehicle would have been helpful. At higher speed tire noise makes these cars just as loud as any others, it is low speed that the issue exists.
-Lego

"Do we insist on baseball cards in bicycle spokes?"

YES! We do.
Anyone who is remotely familiar with biking on a trail knows that cyclists are obligated to inform pedestrians of their approach from behind.
Why? because cycling is a very quite activity and pedestrians can be caught unaware.

I have seen a lot of Prius's on the road and have ridden in several and I have yet to see or hear one that is any quieter than any other car on the road. As for people walking out in front of you and bicycllsts not hearing you, I have had the exact same problems and I drive a 2004 Mazda 6 Sport Wagon which I drive quite conservatively and get 28 to 30 mpg combined. I coast to every stop in nuetral with the engine running and the engine noise does not stop the stupid or unattentive people from walking in front of me.

I think Mark D has it best. If you're driving a really quiet vehicle, you have to be more aware and read people better.
When I pass people on the Manhattan Bridge my bike is making no noise. I have to make the judgement call, ring the bell and possibly frighten them into my path or try to whizz by. I usually just slow down and click my brake handles or something.

I guess for non-electric car types, let the car coast downhill at like 10-15 mph with the engine off (don't lock the steering wheel !!) and the windows down and see for yourself when the tires start making noise.
I think in Europe some cars came with a 'town' and 'country' horn. You would hit the more quiet one for the city and the louder one for the highway.
Also the quieter horn would let people know you're nearby and not being a jerk but just concerned for their well-being. I ring the bell on my bike near almost any parked car with a streetside passenger because I don't want to meet their door.

Bottom line is I think it's the driver's responsibility to be aware regardless of where the inevitable litigation goes.
vsk

Yes, some sort of indication of presence would be nice. As a cyclist I have noticed the hybrids have the ability to "creep" up on me quicker than I am used to. For the arguments about bikes being too quiet, I say that I have a bell, and at the least I can vocalize my presence if need be. I will also argue, with the exception of the blind, that pedestrians should not walk around cities as if in a bubble (I'm talking to you NYC!). People, in general, should pay more attention to their surroundings

Lego: So you walked into a car? Who is the inattentive one?!

the quieter the better. the noise arms race must stop.

Once our dog ran in front of the car and we ran him over. He came out the back and ran up the driveway. He dosen't get in the way anymore.

How do I announce to the ped with the ipod that I am coming?

Here's the annoying thing about this. One solution would be a car engine simulator sound -- like the one these guys created. But how bout 'this: when the stereo is on, everyone gets to hear my NPR "this american life" blasting while I'm sipping my latte (or whatever music I'm rockin') and when it's off, it plays the car engine simulator sound on the external speaker. What's the difference between the two?

Simply rockin' some jams with the window down solves the problem, but also could put you in jeopardy of getting a ticket in most jurisdictions if your stereo is too loud (or in this case, your agumented noise making system).

And that's why I think this debate is absurd. On one hand, you'll have people complaining the car is too loud, on the other, blind pedestrians are complaining the car is too quiet.

This has come up several times over the years on greenhybrid.com, and I think at one point someone suggested GM contributed money to the National Federation of the Blind or whomever raised this concern in the first place... but now I can't remember if that was idle speculation, or if that turned out to be documented somehow.

this issue is so retarded

detroit and big oil must be behind it

1. in no way will a quieter car mean hitting more pedestrians

2. maybe some blind people might "walk into" a quiet car but then if the car is at a intersection what is the person doing walking where cars are anyways

this is so typical the solution? make GAS cars have to be quieter so everyone can hear all vehicles better yet get rid of noisy smelly gas cars altogether

Let me set out the story.
You're on your bike going down a quite country road.
Cars pass you as they do and because of their huge engines you can hear them from almost a mile away.
You see an animal dart across in front of you and you need to swerve out of the way and boom, you're killed instantly by the Prius that you couldn't hear.
You've committed no crime, cyclists are entilted to be on the road. It's the fault of the person driving the car who failed to safely pass another vehicle on the road.

How is this a debate???
All of you need to step outside of your polluting Priuses and experience what it's like out in the world.
We lowered noise pollution from a dollar to a dime and found that we need to ad another dime, and this is the end of the world???

Sorry, but if you swerve to avoid a small animal and end up in another lane of traffic without signaling (even on a bicycle- hand signaling) then you HAVE committed a crime. It may not seem moral, but the traffic laws are designed to protect humans, not critters. And a crime is a violation of laws. If you feel the law is unjust, go ahead and break it. If nothing happens I doubt any cops would give you a ticket. But by making the choice to break traffic regulations and you take responsibility for whatever happens.

Tinkling bells might be pleasant and still let
people know thqt you are approaching.

French Simca cars ( otherwise hopeless) had
both "Country Horns" and "City Horns" - I wish
American cars would install them. Then you
could let the dunderheads ahead of you know
that they are sitting thru the green light without
annoying everyone within hearing range.

i am not a prius owner (yet), and beyond a little startle the first time one quietly pulled up next to me on the street, have had no problem hearing or being aware of them.

that said, the idea of a friendly little bicycle bell sounds really nice.

Also lets make cars smaller and slower so they hurt less. Car driving even a hybrid (myself included) is an environmental crime. Lets make hitting a ped or cyclist a crime which would, I think, change driving behaviour and make drivers much more alert.

Very interesting topic as I live in a mountain community where hitting large wildlife is an issue. I'm all for some kind of white noise or something that might deter animals from jumping out in front of a fast moving vehicle. It would be very annoying to have a car driving in this area playing music or noises that distract the peace and tranquility of nature. But, I had never thought about the danger a quiet car might hold for children or pedestrians. I'd like to throw 'wildlife' into the mix, since they wouldn't have the knowledge someone who is blind would have while walking in high traffic areas.

None-the-less, this is a topic worth discussing.

Please people, when cars first came out the driver was required to stop at an intersection, turn off the car, honk the horn at least 4 times and then start the car and proceed if there were no horses around. Some places even required that you stand up and yell and announcement that you were going to be moving through the intersection. I personally feel that people just need to pay more attention. I have almost been hit 4 times on my scooter which is not electric. Just pay attention please, no goofy requirements to waste time and energy.