Treehugger Buys an SUV - Hell freezes, Arctic Melts?

I think this is a classic case of having a hard time sacrificing for the environment. I feel for you, and totally understand your need for room, I have a family of 5.

However, we are going to pay now: by giving up some convenience and luxury or pay later: with global climate instability.

I think the example that this tree hugger put forward, of having a hard time making this sacrifice, since he had many reasons and the ability not to do so, is symptomatic of how hard it will be to change behavior.

It reminds me of going to a lecture on voluntary simplicity with a friend back in the '90s. We were eating it up, and upon running into her a few months later I asked her how it was going. She said she had told her mother (who had raised her brother and her as a single mom) about the concept. Her mother retorted that in her day they had a similar lifestyle choice, "involuntary simplicity, also known as poverty"

Maybe that is what it will take for people to take a hard look at consumption. The financial instability triggered by global climate change might help us down that path.

Not to be a bummer, and step on your buzz.

[No worries; hey, I don't feel great about the purchase, every time I drive it it's like 'greenhouse gas, greenhouse gas'. I'm super-aware, but we couldn't have gotten anything else. mjo]

[clarification on this - "we couldn't have gotten anything else". What I meant was "we reviewed every option we thought we had, and this was the best choice for us." mjo]

ahh, the good old case of do as I say not as i do, beautiful

[just not that simple mjo]

Weak...Couldn't you have converted a used SUV, to say battery power? For gods sakes please tell me you didn't buy the car brand new.

[I did not buy the car brand new, that was part of the trade-off mjo]

As for space, I'm not really buying that argument unless you tell us your 6'8". Honda's a good company but this still seems like a weak move. Is this just what happens when you get older and have kids? You give in and get conservative (or wasteful in this case)? Sorry if this sounds harsh but you know how you guys write!

So... since you live in the only first world country that won't be internalising the costs of GHG emissions from fuel, will you be taking independent action to offset the increased emissions?

I realise that the CRV is actually a pretty benign example of the SUV type, I'm not really criticising your choice at all, but I do think your last sentence of "Factor in every environmental consideration you can - and I think we did that - but ultimately, you have to choose what is best for you" is just wrong.

Telecommuting and a Bus trip means that your lifetime vehicle emissions are going to be low anyway, obviously. But from what you say above, your decision to buy an SUV was based on a poorly founded perception of increased safety, and the fact that sometimes you need to transport dishwashers.

You don't need an SUV for 3 people. It doesn't have a 3rd row, so you can't cart around more people than a small car. Can you fit a dishwasher in a CRV? More importantly, how often do you tote around dishwashers?

[more than most. We live in the city; as such, most of our need for a car is for heavy stuff - groceries, lumber, etc. This is not a commuting vehicle mjo]

It started going downhill almost immediately when you said "family of three". Unless you live in an extended family long house, you will not be carting your elderlies everywhere, everyday for their entire life. I might've given you some pity points had you had one or two more kids (and then subtracted them for having so many kids unless they were adopted).

Feeling safer in an SUV eh? I feel a lot safer knowing that you're driving around a good two feet above me with your mountain rated 4x4 tires ready to crush me at a whim. But that's ok, you'll be alive and so will your kids...err kid. That is, until your car puts that last little hole in the ozone and our oceans go haywire. I imagine that $5,000 extra that you spent on an eco-friendly table...oh no wait...I mean extra gas, sure helps out.

That would be pretty vitriolic of me to say, luckily it's all sarcasm :p I'm no idiot, I understand emotional needs and wants run pretty high in the human system, and it's pretty hard turning them down sometime, especially if you have a newborn or something along those lines. I can't really vouch for "feeling safer" having driven in one of those, I felt more like I was going to accidentally squish someone. Overall, I hope you're happy with your decision as it will be yours to live with and I'll keep my fingers crossed that you'll look at that Prius a LITTLE bit harder next time :)

From past Treehugger articles:

SUVs not safer for kids
"In fact, a recent study or insurance statistics by the Partners for Child Passenger Safety looked at accidents involving 4,000 children in newer SUV's and found the rates to be almost identical to conventional cars."
You linked to that, so why did you ignore it? It says it makes no difference!

And they're definitely not safer for the people outside your metal box:
Yet another reason to hate SUVs
"The British Medical Journal says that the death rate is double for pedestrians hit by SUV's over those hit by regular cars"

Face it, you wanted an SUV, you know it isn't green, so you've found some bad arguments to try and justify it.

If you aren't willing to make even a small sacrifice then sorry, but I don't think you can call yourself a Treehugger.

Why is this even on this site? You live in Boston and you have an SUV? is the transportation system THAT bad?

[no, it's great. And we use it every day mjo]

From your profile:
"Mark has been in IT for over a decade, working for leading universities and in the environmental consulting space. He is convinced that the only viable future - financially, socially, environmentally - for every business is one that is bright green."
How were you convinced? Are you going to have more trouble convincing businesses to be green when you show up in an SUV? Or, will they be pleased to see the SUV, because from that they can see no personal concessions will be necessary?

[Not really - Business is all about the bottom line and making really difficult choices. This is a perfect example.
mjo]

"Mark is the founder of a Boston-based consulting firm New View Data Solutions, that helps companies reduce technology-related costs, ensure environmental compliance, promote social responsibility, and take advantage of the exploding opportunities in green tech."

So, you make a living greenwashing businesses. It shouldn't surprise us that you don't actually give a ****.

There are hybrids that a comparable to the CRV. E.g. The Saturn Vue.

How come you didn't check out the Saturn Vue Green Line Hybrid? It is pretty much the same type of vehicle as the CRV.

I'm in your same (guilty) boat. I bought a Dodge Caliber last year. I had good reasons for my decision, too I needed all wheel drive for our icy, snowy winters. I needed enough ground clearance to get up mountain roads. I needed cargo room for camping gear. I needed solid construction so I wouldn't have to worry too much about the moose that share our space. That was a serious concern, actually. This past winter, two moose were hit right in front of my condo.
There were choices that would have been more ideal environmentally, but not practical for my lifestyle or budget at that time. I hope that my next car buying experience will afford me more choices of ecologically friendly, practical vehcles.

I hate to break in on your explanation, as others have before me, but you did not "need" to buy this "crossover" SUV, as you keep putting it.

I understand the safety issue that you bring up. However, how often is it that you get into any sort of dangerous situation while driving an automobile? Is your "crossover" SUV really going to protect you that much better than one of your more environmentally friendly options? You may feel safer, but the increased roll-over risk may actually be putting your family in more danger.

[maybe. But safety is not a rational issue - it's a perceived one. it's pretty powerful too - your senses are telling you something mjo]

Also, even if you do limit yourself to a category such as "crossover" SUV, there are many options available to you with a lower carbon footprint than what you have chosen. Fueleconomy.gov makes it easy to find and sort both carbon footprint and emissions data so you can make a wholly informed decision.

I'm pretty sure it's too late at this point to go back and change your mind, but, you realize you have an entire community of helpful, informed environmentalists at your fingertips, right? For future reference, I bet if you posted the question, "What should our next vehicle be?" with a set of specific criteria that you were interested in, you would have received a plethora of good suggestions.

I've transported a dishwasher in the back of my Prius. Actually just this last weekend I helped my mom pick up an antique china cabinet and chair and drove it from San Francisco over the mountains to Salem, Oregon and averaged 48MPG. It was a lot better than using a U-Haul on a hitch off the back of her 25MPG Buick. In the Prius there's 38 inches between the wheel wells and you get over 5 feet with the seats folded down.

Of course you'd only be able to have two people in the car when you're carrying such a large load.

Why didn't you join zipcar or another car-sharing service? They offer minivans and pick-ups for exactly the situations you mention here...If you really don't drive that much, and you live in an urban area (as you wrote you do), car-sharing makes a lot more sense (and can be a LOT cheaper) than buying/owning a car. I'm curious why you didn't address this...

Geez !! What a bunch of holier than thous !!!
Mountain rated tires? Give me a break ! It's a little station wagon a few inches higher than normal.
Come on.
You're acting as if he got a Ford F350 with dualies and a lift kit on it.
If he was a long haul commuter, it's one thing, if driving happens every now and then, well, trade off the extra gallons during the course of a year for a little peace of mind.
You don't forget how to drive just because you drive something bigger than a 1960s Mini Cooper.
Yeah BayBay ! Shagadelic! Stop crying and whinning, he won't hit you. (Check out the Cybercat with all of that guilt).

I have seen plenty of econoboxes driven badly. I have no defense, I am on a bicycle or a motorcycle most of the time.

But come on, all the snarky, smarmy, little girlie men attacks, ... can't you see he's got enough going on... he has kids! (I always joke that kids are for rich people).

OK Mark, now it's your turn, I will pile on just a little.
My car has 252,000 miles on it. I work on it myself, so far so good. 75000? to me that's brand new.

[I agree, I'm pissed man. I bought that car brand new 9 years ago. mjo]

Look at these maniacs telling you to buy a converted electric SUV ( I think they will handle the battery weight better due to their beefier suspensions). I say , oh please! Electrics will come and I will buy one that I like.

What was the gas mileage like on this car compared to your older one?

[it's 3 miles worse mjo]

I would suggest the Toyota Matrix or Scion Xb (boxy)? Also Subaru's little cars are pretty cool too. I just read an article on CNN about space vs. mileage.
In any case, ilegiti no se carborundum, don't let the bloggers get you down! The ozone layer will be just fine. Good Luck!!

[wife wouldn't go for the Matrix, too small. Should I have got divorced? mjo]

vsk

Wow, several other options come up. One (already mentioned) the Saturn Vue Hybrid, or the Toyota Highlander Hybrid. Personally, we needed a lot of space and was driving around an SUV (no, not a cross-over) a few years ago and we traded it in for a minivan. Overall it's more comfortable, has a ton of toys and isn't too awful at the pump. It of course could be better, but the Hybrid SUVs weren't out yet.

Anyway, the word hypocrite does come to mind, as much as I hate to say it, but so does the phrase, "Judge not..." If you can sleep at night, so be it.

I think it would have been a wiser choice to repair your old car. It might be a more expensive option in the long term, but you would save all the energy, metals and so on that are needed to manufacture a new car.

Cry me a river.
This does not sound like good enough justification. I've heard this before from my 'green' friends -- who's wives ultimately pushed the decision to an SUV.

[there was a wife involved, yes mjo]

Inconvenience is just so difficult for Americans, they have it so hard already ;-)

I grew up with a family of FOUR. We had a wagon and a compact. My mother did MOST the transporting using the compact car (she had 2 accidents and was fine too.) Oh, we have SNOW up here too... We tied in/on a lot of stuff on those cars; the wagon helped build my parents house.

We eventually ended up with an old truck (before they had seatbelts) which I now have. It needs minor repair each time because it sits for 5 years at a time.

Somebody should setup a simple co-op truck sharing scheme... Having a largely unused truck is costly, using it is costly... Conventional rentals are costly.

It is odd commenting on someone elses personal decision, but since you created this post apparently just so that we could... I will.

I feel that space is very, very small sacrafice to make, considering what/who you are supporting, what the environmental consequences are, and what kind of message you are sending your child.

For another $1500 you could have fixed up your old car to keep for moving dishwashers and grandma, and bought a hybrid (or Fit, or Yaris, etc.) to satisfy most of your driving needs.

This reads like an ad for the ambivalent. Why chose the shiny image?

Sure we often make choices that trade off environmental criteria against personal desires. It seems to me that by putting it here, you are trying to justify it to yourself and maybe claim some special green identity.

Personally, I would prefer if "treehugger" did not cover "its" particularly anti-environmental choices.

"I'm super-aware, but we couldn't have gotten anything else" - what? Denying choice is antithetical to everything treehugger stands for.

I understand making purchases that aren't environmentally the best for emotional or comfort reasons (I just bought an air conditioner myself), but I have to say I'm baffled by both of your arguments here. Needing space for a family that could easily fit into a Prius is a very common argument for buying SUVs, and yet I'd bet that almost everyone who currently feels like they need an SUV for their family grew up driving around with a family the same size or bigger in nothing larger than a station wagon. I understand the occasional need to carry more people or bigger stuff, but unless this is happening on at least a monthly basis (in which case I would expect your annual mileage to be over 6,000), the environmental impact would be a lot lower for renting an additional or bigger car when you need one than for driving an SUV all the time (even a relatively high-mileage SUV like the CRV). And if you know you'll need one a few days in advance, you can get really cheap rates on rental cars; I've had to rent something twice since giving up my car three months ago, and each time I've gotten rates significantly under $20/day (and if you carry your own car insurance, you do not need to buy the rental agency's).

[we have done the rental thing for years - it is not that easy, particularly in Boston. You drive across town to get there, you rent it, you have to take it back. When you do this every month, you are dropping a few grand a few on rental plus your time mjo]

As for the safety issue -- was "feeling" safer really a significant deciding factor, even though you know SUVs are seriously overrated in that regard? I realize that's a very common reason for buying an SUV, and there is some truth to SUVs being safer in an accident for the occupants, but SUVs also increase the incidence of accidents over all -- partly because they're bigger, heavier, and harder to stop, and partly because they pose a serious visibility problem for smaller cars. I'd also be willing to bet that that feeling of safety makes people more careless drivers, too.

I realize I've got no right to judge or anything here. I'm just baffled by your reasoning, because these reasons you give are exactly the ones that people who don't care about the environment have been giving for wanting to drive SUVs since forever. I saw the headline and read the post expecting some more compelling reason within the interview -- and perfectly willing to admit it, if it was there -- but it just wasn't.

I faced a similar dilemma. What I really wanted was a biodiesel pluggable hybrid. Alas those won't be on the market for a while. I was very tempted to get a Jetta TDI and attempt to run it on biodiesel. We don't have enough biodiesel production where I live yet. I chose the Jetta because it got better mileage than the Prius which was my next choice but it's not pluggable. In stop and go traffic a Prius is ideal. I wanted a Honda Civic Hybrid but it's drive train didn't allow for the engine to be off.

So everything I wanted either didn't exist or wouldn't exist for a few years. I couldn't afford either of the hybrids Honda or Toyota. So I went with a used 2001 Honda Civic. I've gotten great gas mileage. I've gotten as high as 40MPG highway and 33 city though I usually get less than that. I'll adopt what hypermiling techniques make sense for me though.

I hope to make this car last 5 or 6 years until the kind of car I desire becomes available. Of course if I lived where they had decent public transport I'd give up the car altogether, but I don't. 1st choice would be all electric. 2nd choice pluggable biodiesel hybrid 3rd choice pluggable gas hybrid. Though if I end up living close to work I could get a bicycle and my wife and I could live with one vehicle.

My first car was a Mitsubishi Mirage... my second (purchased after the Mirage was totalled in an accident, while parked) was a Honda del Sol... when we had our second child, I traded the del Sol for a VW Cabrio. All three of those cars were manual transmission, and got fantastic gas mileage (35+ mpg city). Two years ago next week, we had a flash flood. Driving home with my son from the grocery, the catchbasin at the end of the street overflowed, and my VW *floated* down the street in 4 ft of water... I crawled out through the window, and then pulled my son out. The next day, I bought a Jeep.

I telecommute, so the Jeep is very lightly driven... but I will never again drive a car that can fit UNDER a semi.

Did you consider the Ford Escape Hybrid? It's proven to be very reliable, offers pretty much everything you were after, and gets ~50% better mileage than the CR-V.... and it's a hypermiler's dream since you can really finesse the hybrid system to get better mileage.

"... and these rentals can really add up."

So have the dishwasher delivered. Or, if you're selling one, have the buyer pick it up. I still doubt they'll come anywhere close to adding up to the price you're going to pay for the additional gas over the next five years.

[nope, we probably spent $1500 a year on rentals mjo]

And second news flash, a CRV doesn't really have the cargo capacity to carry a large boxed item like a dishwasher anyway. So you effectively rationalized your way into buying a larger vehicle (for three people) to in order to possibly, maybe, carry something it can't carry anyway.

[the crv can carry several dishwashers mjo]

You MIGHT want to do some landscaping and carry a half-ton or so of rock, too. By that logic, why not buy an F-350?

The arguments aren't strong enough to justify the purchase, IMO. Hopefully you mean it when you say you don't drive much.

Sometimes I'm amazed that the rest of the world can manage to raise families without SUVs, the way they're talked about in the States.

I seriously have never understood the argument about there not being enough room or that kids aren't safe in a sedan. So many people I know say they "need" a big car for the kids. Three kids fit in a back seat of a Prius or any other sedan just fine. And how often are you carting giant appliances around in your car? I just don't see how these arguments add up to needing an SUV. Especially in a city like Boston where you'd probably want as small a car as possible so you can navigate traffic and park easily.

I take it you didn't try to find an Escape/Mariner/Tribute hybrid first? If you live in the city and drive slow, those hardly use gas at all. Otherwise, a family of three is no excuse to drive something any bigger than a Camry. The CR-V is one of the most efficient SUVs (gets better mileage than some cars), but it's hardly a vehicle for someone trying to set an example.

[we make decisions for our family first; is this much different from every other human on the planet? mjo]

If you need a big car a few times a year - why not just rent one? I can't seriously believe you really need an SUV. So much for your green commitments.

"... and these rentals can really add up."

Home Depot rents trucks for about $20 (for 75 minutes)

I probably use these about three times a year at most, and the gas I save the rest of the year in my compact car more than makes up for the money spent on the rental.

It's not as convenient as owning a truck, but I don't consider it convenient to spend twice as much gas on a normal basis.

When we get out of our townhouse and into a house, I intend to get a small trailer and save the extra drive and expense. I've been wanting one for my kayaks anyway, and pretty much any small car can tow at least 500 lbs without much trouble.

Treehugger is one of the few trusted sources of information - and again you present reality as it is. Unfortunately for you, you set the bar high, if you cant reach it many others will sway too - you must realise that you have a huge power to influence, you are trend makers and leaders..

[I agree, but let's not simplify. I would argue that we have a rather odd transportation requirements; two working parents with no commute, for starters. We weren't in the "I'm driving 100 miles a day for for 100K job in a rustbucket, and I just swapped it for a Prius!" scenario. mjo]

Being british, we love to knock down the hypocritical and do so with much glee, can't say I am impressed, but i can empathise - no doubt there were more immediate needs that had to met before the environment (for once!).

Boston has zipcar, which means you need a truck for something you got it, for an hour or 24.

Boston has public transportation to die for, Boston is walkable/bikeable.

At least you came clean about it, for what that's worth, but you lost me somewhere along the way.

Hitting unsubscribe, and looking elsewhere for inspiration.

Well, as a treehugger I went through this dilemma. I live in the French countryside and shoot landscapes out here (I really do need a 4wd to get to some of the inaccessible places I shoot. (walking takes too long!)
I opted for a 3yo diesel RAV4 with 100k miles on the clock, which I am planning to have converted to run on raw vege oil. (conversion from www.elsbett.com (and available in the US...)) (the car gives about 40mpg now!) This seemed like the best option. I know you are stuck with petrol gas guzzling engines there, but there must have been a better solution than the Honda with it's lousy fuel consumption.

I think the Ford Escape hybrid is a much better choice. You can really do a lot better on gas with it, especially if you're a hypermiller. Furthermore, it could actually accommodate a large(r) purchase like a small to mid sized appliance or a large TV with ease. You claim you needed room for kids (and things, and kids things), but I test drove a CRV and we couldn't comfortably seat four adults (only one being over 6') in it. The Escape also has excellent safety ratings, and you would've spent the same if not less money for a car that would've been a better fit for your needs as you describe them. Furthermore, if you're a family of three, how much of your extended family were you going to try to cram into the CRV? Sounds more like you didn't do proper research and got hung up on a name brand over the actual functionality you needed.

I've gotta say that's about the worst Treehugger story I've ever read.

Sure, we're all crap at the environment from time to time, but to then do a "justification" piece on exactly what we DON'T want to be doing???

I agree with the people above bewildered about your reasons as well.

A point on the space issue, that could easily be geared up to say you should have a van, as they carry even more. Will your new CRV carry a few 15' lengths of timber to make that chook shed/vegie garden/whatever?

At the end of the day it IS that simple. How much did the new SUV cost? A lot less than the $1,500 to repair the old car I'd say. Even if the repairs double to $3,000, it's be better to keep the old thing until a manufacturer releases a SUV (or whatever) that's part of the solution, rather than the problem.

He only drives 6,000 miles a year, and doesn't use the vehicle to commute. It doesn't really matter what he drives -- his consumption (~200gal, assuming 30mpg) will still be an order of magnitude less than what I burn while driving my 40mpg Jetta TDI for 45,000 miles(~1125gal).

From what I've gathered, the average driver drives about 12,000 miles per year. He probably could drive a Hummer H3 and still not be too far away from the average fuel consumption.

P.S. I plan to move within walking distance of work, but we'll see how quickly my house sells...

Lame. This shouldn't even be a dilemma. You knew the right thing to do, and you couldn't bear to be inconvenienced so you didn't do it. End of story. Tired of hearing about how "it's more complicated than that." It isn't.

I can empathize with your general predicament but justifying the purchase with flawed logic (SUV's safer, need SUV cargo size, etc) isn't going to help you sleep at night (or get much positive response on this blog).

Did you consider wagons? The 1999-2005 VW Jetta Wagon has 71 cubic feet of storage with the seats folded down, and the diesel version gets 42/50mpg, plus you can run biodiesel.

[had the Passat wagon - it was terrible, a sludge bucket. Sold it after 3 years mjo]

Need to haul lumber? No problem. Add a trailer hitch? Easy. 600-900 miles per tank (not kidding)? Doable. Low maintenance engine that should last 300K+ miles? Done.

Where's the love for high-mpg wagon!? Crossovers have the same storage space. The only excuse that's left is "SUV's feel safer", which is not true.

I have (literally) brought home a dishwasher in a Scion XA -- one of the smallest, cheapest, most efficient vehicles in America (Toyota Echo in the rest of the world).

We had to take the dishwasher out of the box at the store -- the styrofoam around the box was a deal-killer. But the dishwasher itself fit just fine. The hatch even closed.

I have moved home from college in an XA. I have brought home a smallish, live/balled Christmas tree in an XA. On Saturday I fit 4 laundry tubs, groceries, a pushcart and a wife in an XA.

I would get a larger car if I had a family of 4 or more. But for 1-3, the venerable subcompact hatchback is plenty of space. And I have never gotten less than 31 mpg, even in CITY driving.

At least you have the courage to admit what you're doing. But you're really fooling yourself if you think you're going through the decision making process any differently than anyone else making environmentally irresponsible decisions. "I'd like to do what's best for the planet, but I have to do what's best for me." But really we all do it at some point, even though we ought not to.

[thanks Matt - yes, this is a courageous story. I'm don't think I'm fooling myself - this IS the way people make decisions. It's not targeted towards the biodiesels crowd, but towards the crowd who buys CRV and the like, the most popular SUV sold in America. Sometimes people miss that. mjo]

What I would really like to know is what similar vehicles did you consider? Why not a Mazda/Mercury/Ford Escape Hybrid (or at least a Saturn Vue as someone else asked)?

[we drove the following - Prius, Accord Hybrid, RAV4, CRV, Odessey, Scion. mjo]

One thing that ticks me off is that well-meaning people "But what if..." themselves into these sorts of vehicles when there are probably some simple solutions. How about foregoing the trunk on regular cars in favor of more seating(perhaps only big enough for children) and selling cars with the ability to tow an optional light trailer for when you need to bring the dishwasher home from the store?

Why not just get an Excursion or hell, an International CXT? Because, you know, having space in a car is a funny thing - you don't need it all the time, but when you need it, there aren't a lot of options; you aren't going to get a dishwasher into a Prius, or a refrigerator into a CRV, or transport your extended family around when you are all together and going somewhere.

And of course you feel safe -- but maybe you should have read this a few years ago? http://malcolmgladwell.com/2004/2004_01_12_a_suv.html

And stating that a hybrid would not fit your needs shows that you obviously didn't consider all of your options.

Now I admire your general do-goodery, but perhaps you should actually live by this "He is convinced that the only viable future - financially, socially, environmentally - for every business is one that is bright green."

Sounds like the environment was not taken into consideration for your decision making.

You're argument of having the luxury of space "when you need it" is the same one made day in and day out by people who drive large cars.

Your safety argument comes down to the American mentality of "bigger is better", which has been shown to clearly not be the case.

You seem to have the same mentality of every individual who doesn't want to give up a damn thing for the environment, I hope you enjoy your new and soon to be obsolete purchase.

Interesting picture at the top of this link:

http://bridger.us/2002/12/16/CrashTestingMINICooperVsFordF150/

Check out those dummies...

Wow. I'm a long-time lurker, first time commenter. Like many others I am bewildered by your cavalier attitude to sacrifice for the greater good.

[If you like, you could buy carbon offsets for my vehicle to 'sacrifice for the greater good'. If interested, let me know mjo]

The argument that the SUV in question will only be used a small amount is misguided--my country (New Zealand) produces about 0.02% (or is it 0.2? I forget) of the world's greenhouse gases, but we still signed the Kyoto Protocol, because it's a CUMULATIVE not GROSS effect--everyone needs to buy into this, no matter how small the contribution is.

In presenting yourself as a treehugger, you raise the standards to which we hold you, and you have fallen sadly short. You freely admit to basing your decision on illogical reasoning. It is also based on selfishness--keep your money in your pocket rather than spending a little extra to help the environment.

[This is a real, raw story - it might be not what you wanted to hear but I did the best I could. Judge if you must mjo]

In the words of Osmaf: Hitting unsubscribe, and looking elsewhere for inspiration.

Less than impressed.

I've been driving an xA for two years now, and there's only been one thing that I couldn't haul with it, a big plasma screen (not mine, but it does use less juice than my CRT-based TV). I found out then that the dimensions for what an SUV can carry and what I can carry are surprisingly very close. My cousin has a Pacifica, and he has the same vertical clearance that my car has, but an extra 8 inches horizontally, and quite a bit more depth. In the end, we had to rent from Home Depot.

I've hauled queen-sized beds (too big for your SUV), plywood (too big for your SUV), and even a couch (too big for your SUV) *on* my xA... Anything bigger costs $20 at Home Depot. The 'carrying dishwashers' argument is incredibly weak.

And sure, your SUV may feel safer to your and your family, but it's less safe to pedestrians, pedelers, and tree-huggers that actually stand up for what they believe in and buy small cars.

But it's a classic American tale. Sure, i want everyone else to do what is best, but when it comes to me and my own, to hell everyone else. It's exactly what this site is supposed to be against... caring about the planet, the economy, and everyone else.

We will not be able to slow, let along reverse the climate crisis as long as people believe that buying a car is a "personal" decision. It's not personal; it effects the entire planet and the future. If you really understood that, you would have worked around your inconveniences and made an ecological buying decision. Instead you were the average rationalizing American. Seeing this article on Treehugger makes me sad.

[It's true, I'm no superstar - I'm a dad, a family man, who has real problems and expenses, pays rent, and occasionally likes to go out to eat. I try and get through life and do the right thing; and sometimes I have to drive to do it. I explain on TH these real issues in the hopes that it helps the other less-than-superstars out there make better decisions for them. mjo]

Safer for you.
More dangerous for anyone you hit.
More dangerous for all the victims of climate change and long-term pollution effects.

Reminds me of arms races.

mjo: I'm all for personal responsibility and consumer choice--though I recognise that people are inclined to look for the most economical option. Fortunately for the environment that means I bike to work and don't own a car.

IMHO taxes and road user charges should be linked to a cars environmental impact. Perhaps that would encourage people with weak convictions to look closer at environmentally sound options.

Wow... I sympathize Mark, honestly i do. What on earth possessed you to post this anyway? Full disclosure and good will i suppose. Seems a tad lost on some of the less friendly posters commenters isn't it?

[I posted this because it was a hard decision, a hard decision that didn't have a clear 'oh, I feel great' outcome. I hope people can relate to this mjo]

Ah well, in the spirit of CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM;

- Get the Prius, have a rack installed on the roof. Space problem solved.

Everything else i could think of was already answered by Howard;

- Did you consider wagons? The 1999-2005 VW Jetta Wagon has 71 cubic feet of storage with the seats folded down, and the diesel version gets 42/50mpg, plus you can run biodiesel.

[had a VW wagon, died after 3 years! sludge problem in engine mjo]

- Need to haul lumber? No problem. Add a trailer hitch? Easy. 600-900 miles per tank (not kidding)? Doable. Low maintenance engine that should last 300K+ miles? Done.

Hang on to the SUV till a Prius makes itself available, the do a trade with the dealer. ;)

[might do that mjo]

I can't add much more to the bang-on comments already posted, except this: If you're so green what the hell are you doing with a water-guzzling dishwasher?? Don't you have a sink?

Your argument is that a car like a prius cannot hold a dishwasher and is not roomy enough.
There is plenty of cargo space in that particular hatchback (prius) and I am betting that a dishwasher (box an all) could easily fit into a prius with the seats folded down.

Second of all, the sensation of driving a tank and the "roominess" are the reasons any old schlep drives an FUV, sorry, SUV.

If you cannot sacrifice the superior feeling of driving a large vehicle and cannot sacrifice some shoulder room, and therefore choose an SUV upon those grounds, you obviously do not care much for a sustainable future.

On top of that, you could have easily and economically (provided you rarely drive) bought a used vehicle instead of causing new resources to be turned into a SUV.

Come on Treehugger! ;o) I was expecting some well thought out arguments to justify the need for an SUV. The short of it is, unless you regularly drive in off-road type conditions, you don't need an SUV, 4x4 or all-wheel drive vehicle.

The word "need" cropped up a few too many times in this article/interview for my taste. Needing "space" (for 3 people?) and "feeling safer" are all emotive arguments. It's very easy to justify anything if you're convinced you "need" it.

Unfortunately, the "need" i.e. desire for an SUV is often based on prestige/status which is a little too complicated (pun intended) to elaborate here. An SUV, however small, is likely a "vanity" purchase in most cases, especially for a family of 3 living in an urban area.

[believe me, I'm not in it for status - I don't give a damn what I drive mjo]

Though, I suspect that most small SUV owners argue that they are "greener" than others because theirs is a small/fuel-efficient *chokes* SUV. Oops! there goes the argument for "need lots of interior space".

And the list goes on...the sheer number of comments speak for themselves here.

On a more positive note, Treehugger will likely get lots of traffic with this post....always good to keep the $ponsors happy. ;0)

Interesting story and comments. Well, the Prius does get double the mileage of the CR-V, but they're nearly the same size. The CR-V is only 2.9 inches longer and 3.7 inches wider so it's not taking up much more space on the road.

It may actually be more eco-friendly to produce than the Prius with less batteries to produce (whether it is or isn't I have no idea). The fuel economy is the killer, but maybe he can make up for that in other ways. I personally believe most things can be accomplished by mass transit, bike and foot in the city. Boston has a pretty great transit system with the subway and suburban rail, but I hear it's not so friendly to bikes - save for Cambridge which is somewhat friendly and very walkable.

Change doesn't happen overnight in this country, but there is hope. Hell, my dad sold his huge 4-door Ford longbed 4x4 and bought a small Kia out in Colorado. Hope indeed!

Considering the CRV doesn't have a 3rd row seat, I'm unclear how your justify your statement, "transport your extended family around when you are all together and going somewhere"? The Prius has exactly five seat belts. I'm sure you are well aware the CRV has exactly the same number. Do you plan to put the grandparents in the cargo area?

[no, I sit there mjo]

You must be joking about carrying a dishwasher. How often does this ACTUALLY happen? Have you heard of home delivery?

I could be wrong, but you don't strike me as the home improvement type that runs to Home Depot to pick up a truck load of materials for a job.

Do us all a favor and stop posting on this site.

I do have to say that I am with the person that pointed out the family of three. The convenience of the extra space is nce, but it is overrated. I'm sorry but I don't like excuses like that. If you really wanted to save the environment, you should have stayed with you beliefs. I have both test drove a Prius and a Camry hybrid. The Prius has plenty of room and excellent gas mileage. As for the Camry it has a lot more room, and still gets better gas mileage than the SUV's that I know of. It is almost like saying that I know I have a farm next door that sells fresh organic food year round, but I prefer the produce at the store that is twenty miles away, that is not a valid excuse. As for the new car new parts, warranty etc. I was an automotive technician for 7 years working at dealerships and just to buy a brand new car vs. a used car with low miles and still under warranty does not make sense cosidering you can buy extended warranties and not lose thousands of dollars driving it off the lot.

MJO - will you publish my story when we replace our aging minivan with a new Expedition EL?

[I'd love to! Send it! mjo]

I can't wait to read the comments I'll get from this crowd. The pretentious and judgmental comments are priceless.

So, why would someone who frequents Treehugger.com consider an Expedition EL? Simple, we have 4 kids and just found theres another on the way. (we were being careful but clearly not careful enough) Now I'm sure the 5 kids is enough to spin up many of the commenters but let's keep to the vehicle topic.
So, with 5 kids we obviously cannot fit legally and safely (not to mention comfortably) into a Pious ...er... Prius. So, here in the USA our options for a family of 7 are most minivans, large crossovers, large SUV's, and full size vans. Good luck topping 30 mpg in those options. There are a few small to mid size 7 person SUV/Crossovers but really, what's the point? Sure they can fit 7 but nothing more and frankly their slightly better fuel economy is countered by their near uselessness to carry anything. If I got a small one I'd also have to get a trailer or rooftop carrier and that would blow any mpg advantage.

So, our current plan is to get a diesel Expedition EL next year.

Of course, with the price premium we will have to pay for the diesel version it will probably not make any kind of economical sense.

Besides, don't most peoples homes cause far more pollution than their cars? With that in mind it would make more sense for me to focus my green attention on my home wouldn't it?

At the time I bought my Prius, my husband and I assumed that we'd want and need my husband's Camry for family vacations (we're a family of 4). In the end, we always ended up using the Prius instead. For a 5-hour trip to Maine to see the parents, why drive a car that gets 25 - 30 MPG when you can drive a car that gets 45 MPG? Sure, we have to pack less and we had to carefully purchase new luggage based on the dimensions of the Prius trunk. So what? As the kids get bigger and their luggage gets bigger, we'll throw it on the roof. Just like the olden days, when people didn't expect total convenience at all times!

Flying can be a real PITA. So, the dilemma, do I purchase a seat on a commercial flight or buy my own jet. It sure is nice to have a jet "when you need it." Sure it might cause more harm to my environment which supports me, but let's be reasonable. Have you ever flown commercially? That starts to add up. I opted for the jumbo jet, because it holds more. I rarely need it, but when I do, boy-o-boy. And when I crash, I have a better chance of surviving and buying another jet. And that makes sense!

[you should do what's best for you, you seem educated on the options. Me, I hardly ever fly. mjo]

But what about being green?

It doesn't count for me because I don't care.

Don't you call yourself a treehugger though?

Yes, but that still doesn't matter, because when it comes to convenience, I can't make that sacrifice. It's all about me me me. And when my lifestyle is good for the environment, then I guess that's a bonus.

[that's the sweet spot, yes, when your lifestyle and the environment coincide mjo]

Weren't there other options, like a used car, a station wagon, maybe a diesel VW, a trailer?

Yes.

Do you think you have set a good example for your child?

[Now, this is a good question. Frankly, I don' know. I try and explain to him that these questions are complicated and do not have an easy answer. I explain that he should try and do the right thing, and I try and explain what I think that means. mjo]

…

How is this different from the millions of people that buy cars every year?

They are not in the spotlight, that's about it.

MJO-- thanks for posting this. I'm sure you knew what the reaction would be, and you did it anyway. More importantly, you're actually reading the comments and responding to your critics. To those who say they're not going to look elsewhere for inspiration, I hope you find it from someone with equal integrity.

I'm in a similar position to you in that I'm about to purchase a new car. Now, I'm not going to buy an SUV. But I'm also not going to buy a hybrid. Many people seem to believe that they're the ultimate answer to fuel efficiency, and they just aren't. They may be *an* answer someday when more vehicle classes are hybrids. The many commenters who've excoriated you for not buying one might want to look at their own reasoning in pushing them when they're not the right answer for every situation, even though we might wish it to be so.

For those of us who are making little efforts to become more green and who are just starting out on the path the reactions you've gotten are a big negative. So many commenters seem to feel it's an all or nothing proposition when in some cases it can be a transition--sometimes a slow one. I know I don't buy a car very often so if I'm not at the point where I'm ready I won't just dump the current vehicle to satisfy the "more-eco-than-thou" crowd. But I would make the ecological impact of the vehicle a primary concern when it came time to make my next purchase.

The bottom line for me is this. I wouldn't dare call myself a TreeHugger because honestly I'm not there yet. And while I'm willing to make the necessary sacrifices the reactions you've gotten here would encourage me to be quiet about them. I have to live up to my own standards and make the best choices I can. Not be bullied into making a choice that isn't right for me because it doesn't fit an "extremist" idea of what it means to be green. When you abuse the people who at least try to do the right thing you push your allies away.

[thanks, you are the targeted audience for this article mjo]

Wow. Never expected to read this here.

This is like the refrigerator wars. In other countries, it's all about economy, saving space, and smaller frigs that reflect a way of life that doesn't mean stocking the frig at all times for WWIII. People in the US buy the biggest frig they can find and afford, and then they have to keep the sucker full in order to make it the most energy efficient, which means tons of food that can't possibly be eaten in a timely manner by the 3.1 people living in the house. So waste of energy for a frig that's too big, waste of food to keep the frig full for better efficiency, waste of money. But people "expect" a large frig, so everyone puts in the biggest they can, pretending they're energy efficient. And wow, you can entertain the third armored division for Thanksgiving, but it's much more than you need the other 364 days of the year.

The fact that you bought a car with WORSE fuel economy is stunning. I expect that you -- and the people who work here -- are ready to make the hard choice when it comes to purchases like this. I expect you to be ahead of the pack, not behind. I expect you to see beyond marketing and take a chance. I expect you to see that you can take your family size, safety and the environment into account and come out a winner on all fronts.

I know it's a hard choice. I'd like a Mini, but higher off the ground (although I'll claim that "need" because of a bum knee). I'd like a Smart car for 4. I'd like to be able to buy everything I want at Ikea and haul it all home. I really want a Star Wars car that glides on air.

Hmmm. I still can't believe you bought a CRV.

Norway has recently passed legislation to prohibit car companies from advertising any vehicle as "environmentally friendly." I agree - even a second-generation Prius emits 4 tons of CO2 per year given the typical number of miles traveled by an average American. Wanna be green? Move out of the burbs, live closer to the city (or in it), use mass transit and dump that car! Need I mention peak oil as another reason not move your 180-pound bottom around in a 3,000-pound metal box?

At least tell me this dishwasher you are carting around all the time is an energy star model.

[ I get the best man mjo]

[also, the dishwasher is just an example of a typical large bulky object, it could be anything. I'm not in the dishwasher business mjo]

20 city, 27 highway.

That's pathetic.

Seeing as how you already chose to go used, why on earth did you not simply get a 2005 Passat TDI wagon?

I could lay into you on everything else, but it seems a huge crowd already bum rushed to door to rake you over the coals. What was this post about, penance? You obviously knew what you were getting into here. Kooky behavior if you ask me.

MJO: You made your purchase, you wrote this article rationalizing it, and now you're here defending it.

The problem is that, as near as I could tell, you bought a larger vehicle to support your illusions of safety, and in order to support all of the things you MAY need to do 1% of the time (carry a dishwasher), and NOT to support the things you do 99% of the time (drive to work, store, parents, etc.).

You also supported that rationalization with the idea that you spend $1,200 a year in rentals (WTF?).

So, personally, I would (and will) buy a smaller vehicle and then borrow or rent something else as needed. Further, for less than a grand you could have bought a small two-wheel trailer or flatbed that nearly ANY car could have towed with a trailer hitch. Keep it at mom's, or a friend's, or whatever.

And which then could have carried almost anything you could imagine. Certainly more than the CRV, which also indicates that your rental expenditures, though reduced, are still not going to be zero.

And for anyone else reading this, I repeat: plan for the common, day-to-day, 99% use case, and not for all of the someday, maybe, could be's...

ok I have 3 dogs a lab nuffy mix (100+ lbs in his prime) a begal hound mix 50 lbs and a 130 lb st bernard! I need room. I traded in my explorer for my escape hybrid and I must say at over $4 a gallon by the end of summer (my personal prediction) i made the right choice. I can actually fit all 3 dogs, both grand kids ages 9 and 6 ( with the back seat (60/40) lay down the 40% kids sit in the 60% side) and another adult in front with me. I dont know where the epa gets there milage est but worst milage is 30 and thats when i have extream cold (zaps the battery ) and if i run the air conditioner in july and augst, any other time 34-38 mpg and thats combined highway city - better then the est, its american and its tree hugger friendly! you should have shopped more!

I was in the same situation before. However if I were to start my car shopping again, I would have come out a different decision than buying an SUV. Here's my story, my wife's car was totalled 2006 in a car accident that put we in a eager position for car shopping.

Me and my wife were planning to have a baby sometime soon and as car is a long lasting goods. Your car decision needs to cover at least your usage in the next 5 years. At that time, we thought about our needs. We live in silicon valley, we go skiing 5-10 times a year, our other car is a 6 yrs old 2door subaru so it's not quite family oriented. We want more room for our car so we can accomodate the baby , and the extra stuff that comes w/ a baby. I'm 6'1" and my wife's uncle is 6'4", so we want something that has more back row space. I did a lot of research and given our needs, an SUV or a wagon can fit our needs very well. By that time, our car shopping list contains BMW 5 series wagon, Subaru outback, Toyota Rav4, Honda Element, BMW X3 and Toyota Matrix. We finally got a BMW X3, it's a small size SUV and at 2006 gas price still remains a relatively low level (~$2.5/gal), we thought it was a good choice for us. A year later, we had the baby and we are very delighted the usefulness of the trunk space of an SUV. Then in late 2007, gas price start to skyrocket and we start to think about whether our early decision was right.

We thought about trading the car w/ a hybrid (which would forgo our needs to be able to go up in snow) or trading another more efficient AWD car. We drove only around 10000miles/yr on so apparently trading to a more efficient AWD car (which is the Matrix or outback) isn't a sound idea to us.

So what we did to combat high gas price is to bike to work myself and we drove the more efficient car whenever we are not travelling with 4 people in the car. We drove much less longer trip now. We are able to cut the mileage on both car for at least 2000miles/yr. If I were to make the decision again, I'll probably choose the outback now. I think I'm in a very common dilemma now, to trade or not to trade. Bottom line is, if you are in the market to buy a car now, don't be fooled by the idea that a heavier car is safer. If everybody buy an SUV, obviously you don't have any advantage at all. Buy it only when you really need the character of an SUV and you are paying for it (financially and environmentally).

I understand that sometimes the counter-intuitive choice is the "right" one. (Although, sorry to say, I don't find this article very compelling.)

We're struggling with a similar situation right now: whether or not buying a 100% electric cityZENN is a step forward or a step backwards for a car-free family.

The short version of our dilemma stacks up like this:

Step Forward: we're supporting and promoting the technology we believe in, and because while we don't own a car, we end up in cabs, family/friend vehicles or public transportation that isn't as green.

Step Backwards: no car = no emissions, fewer trips to the store and less chance of buying more crap than we can carry home when we do go to a store.

If you're interested in the long version of my thought process, or want to weigh in and help us think through this issue, click through to our site and feel free to comment.

It's too bad that your subjective feeling of safety outweighed the objectively increased danger to others from collision and emissions, making it harder for others to make better choices in turn. This is why real progress won't happen until people simply can't afford to make these kind of choices.

[I don't think that's it - look at housing, the credit markets. People willfully bought and spent more than they could afford. They couldn't afford to make these choices, yet they made them anyway. Why is that? mjo]

Simply disappointing. I feel dumber for reading this. More space, more safety? Are you kidding? And I bet you can get a dishwasher in a Pruis (not that I have tried it, but it is pretty roomy in the back with the seats folded down...)

Your reasoning has nothing to do with not wanting to sacrifice, or added convenience. The CRV, while a great vehicle, has no extras compared to the Prius. I sold a CR-V and bought a prius three years ago. Haven't regretted it once. And, SUVs of that size are simply less than cars like the Prius.

[This is a good point - actually I believe that the CRV is right on the edge of convenience and sacrifice for us - it only won out by a small margin. I feel like I'm doomed to drive a vehicle I have mixed feelings about for ten years mjo]

http://www.iihs.org/brochures/pdf/sfsc.pdf
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060103/AUTO01/601030323/1148

Disappointing that you are willing to write about the sacrifices that the masses must make but yet you are unwilling to make the same sacrifices. I am sorry but there are many in this country and around the world that "make it" by transporting their families in small cars. As for transporting your family put a rack on the top when/if you travel. I can fit five adults in a Prius comfortably. (two of which are six feet tall)

In the end, it is your decision, you need to live with it but don't try to rationalize your decisions to people that are willing to make sacrifices.

[I hope you make the smallest sacrifice you can for your family, I'm sure they deserve it mjo]

Your "justification" only made it worse. It makes me wonder about the other lifestyle choices you make. I think you shot yourself in the foot with this one mate. You should've just kept your purchase a secret. I'm still going to read your blog though (why should I stop?).

Btw.... I'm dissapointed that Honda hasn't created a hybrid version of the CRV. It has a "hybrid-look" after all and would also make an ideal hybrid. Toyota has the Highlander Hybrid (u should have gotten that) and Lexus has the RX400h. Why not Acura and Honda? Shame....

We bought an Escape Hybrid when they first came out in late 2004 (an early release 2005 model year) for my family of four (car seats included, fills most of the back seats in any 4 door).
1> The Escape gets about 31 actual MPG combined city/hwy for a vehicle that can carry all of us, and do some hauling, or carry the in-laws with us, assuming one of them wants to ride in the cargo area with the stroller.
2>The vehicle is not imported (which I would assume would lower it's carbon footprint slightly from a Japanese import
3>The Escape is union made
4>The mileage on the 2005 Escape kicks the snot out of any of GMs hybrids, and has even better mileage than the current 2008 Hybrid Escape-- sad, but true.
5>For cargo/family use, it has better mileage than any SUV, period.
6>We haven't had any issues with it, although we only drive about 7500 mi a year.
I can't help but compare this to my parents as a case in point, who are so concious about their consumption, yet have more impact: I've had the "defend my SUV" discussion with them, and must also add the following...

7>Compared to my empty nest parents who bought a Corolla, we have less greenhouse gas emissions from our Escape vs. the corolla. The combustion engine shuts down when idling.
8>Our main use of the vehicle, on weekends, involves a FULL vehicle, with 4 passengers, in short routes... whereas my folks often drive alone, and their rural living creates the need to drive long distances, usually averaging 24000 miles/year.
SO, I would argue that it isn't the SUV vs Prius as the only factor, it could also be distances driven, amount of passengers, type of driving (urban vs rural, etc.)

Bah. You are all wrong. Yes there are better choices than the CR-V, but their are much worse.

I do not consider the Prius to be a truly "green" car because the kinks have not yet been worked out. They still do not work well in situations where they are left to sit as the batteries go bad. When the batteries DO go bad you get stuck with a $5000 repair bill on a car worth $4000. And it STILL gets its primary power from fossil fuels.

The CR-V is a crossover, which basically means it is a tall Honda Civic Wagon. It has a 4-cylinder engine and front wheel drive. It is probably one of the highest mileage non-hybrid SUV's on the market and does have quite good emissions records. It weighs less than a similarly sized truck-based SUVs like Ford Escape or Jeep Liberty.

That said, there are better choices. SUV buyers buy them mostly for the "perceived safeness" and road view. A good size station wagon like the Taurus X or Volvo V70 would give you more space and safety, while returning equally good mileage, or a Toyota Matrix or Dodge Caliber could have bettered it in every direction except ride height.

In the end it comes down to personal choice. I hope your CR-V is at least PAINTED green

This thread exemplifies why I am discomforted by the green movement: the people on the fringes yelling that they know best, and their willingness to impose their belief on you. They are worse than any fundie I ever met: at least fundies can forgive you your sin, green fascists only want you to freeze in the dark, preferably asap.

[yep, not one comment yet on my zero mile commute mjo]

I read Treehugger regularly because I share some core values, arriving from a starting position of cheapness. (FRUGAL, I'm FRUGAL.)

I am interested in all the topics presented. However, I am not interested in being lectured or criticized for my opinions, beliefs, or decisions.

This is a hateful thread and I really admire the courage of the poster to step into it.

Well. better than you buy a 4L GMC I think. I am not sure which version you got but mine is the 2 liter version. Its actually pretty economical and most sedans have way bigger engines.

I understand that my commutes contribute to global warming and pollution everyday but I try to change my lifestyle to be as sustainable for the environment as possible. From growing trees to reusing rainwater to composting or building my small house from mainly recycled materials (roofs, beams, doors) and having solar panels to offset some of the energy we use or not having aircondtioning, central heater or dishwashers I believe can help balance my SUV usage and its infraction to the environment. We only have one car in the house and the kids ride their bikes to school and back. I hypermill like crazy and coast every chance I get!

I bet you most of the sedans you guys have are bigger in engine size than my 2 liter CR-V (not much power though).

You're a hypocrite - and worse, you wanted to ease your guilty conscience by trying to justify yourself here.

Vehicles aren't just a problem for the fuel they use up, it's also the resources that go into them, the metal and plastic, and the cost of putting it all together. Your supposed light usage still uses a hell of a lot of resources. How can you call yourself an environmentalist when you buy a SUV for primarily urban use? To carry how many dishwashers a year? To put more cyclists at risk? As far as I'm concerned you're just another free rider, and worse you're a greenwasher - and while the rest of us put the work in, and put up with inconvenience, to do our bit, you can feel safe and comfortable.

I think the solution is to go with a suitable car for your most prevalent driving and then if you need a pickup to move appliances, just rent one. I'm contemplating this for my next car. If I need to drive 200 miles, I'll get a car for the day the day or the trip that will do the job. We don't all need to *always* drive vehicles that will haul everything we might want to load up over the years.

I think there's a market here for car rental places to fill in with renting cars/trucks for long drives and specifically to load up what won't fit in a more reasonable car.

If we all drive super efficient EVs on a daily basis and then spend a few days each year getting 10-20MPG on special occasions, I call that a win.

I have read all the comments and all of the author's responses, and I must say, I see plenty of justifying and rationalizing.

I agree these are tough decisions, but at the same time, it is those who are willing to close the gap between what they want to do and what they know they should do that hold the potential to make positive impact.

This article could have been about anything: recycling, CFL's not having multiple children, telecommuting. None of those options are easy - they all are hard decision - but in the end, if we want to do what is good for all the world (not just our families) we have to close those gaps. Lets be honest, none of us NEED an SUV. When most of the world does without any vehicle, it is hard to justify purchasing an SUV. As gandhi said, "there is enough for everyone's need, but not enough for everyone's green." We need to live simply so others can simply live.

This is something that I considered a while ago. In the past I used to drive a pickup truck. It got about 17 miles per gallon. I gave it up when gas hit $3 a gallon and switched to a motorcycle. Now I get four times the miles per gallon but can't haul too much. I considered buying another truck or a large car but ran the numbers and it works out to be much more economical to just rent a truck when I need to haul things or rent a car when I have some long distance driving to do.

Can someone share with the class what the most Treehugger approved vehicle would be for a family of 7 (2 adults, 5 kids)?

Obviously the Prius will not work so how can someone who wants to do better than the default minivan or Suburban be more green in their vehicle choice.
BTW, I live in the US so diesel options are not an option for another year or two.

As many other people have said what's wrong with a Ford Escape hybrid or a Saturn Vue Greenline? That being said I don't know why you "need a car with more space" There are so many accessories that you can strap on to your car these days to make an SUV unnecessary aside from ground clearance and towing.

[I did not trust the Ford or Saturn brands, having had a bad experience with them mjo]

If you need extra space you can put a hitch on your sedan and carry a hitch rack with a cargo box. Or you can get a cargo box to fit on your roof. If you really need space go with both. Or tow a small trailer. Your CRV really does not have much extra space compared to many other cars.

On another note...Not a lot of people talk about the energy that goes into manufacturing that new car. By not fixing the old one you are a part of the disposable society that we live in. Learn a little about cars so that you can be an educated driver. A little reading will allow you to fix most any problem with a car or at the least recognize what might be the problem so you don't get hosed at the mechanics.

I say keep your car going as long as possible. It is less expensive over the long term and possibly more environmentally friendly.

Why do people read TreeHugger? Presumably, a good number read it for the same reason I do: to be exposed to interesting, innovative, and/or inspirational stories about how we can lessen our impact on the planet.

I don't doubt that MJO vested much fretting in his decision about which vehicle to purchase. However, the fact that he concluded a CRV was the right choice for him makes this post more suited to NeedMySUV.com than TreeHugger.

I recently turned down a short-term contract in Greenland because of the emissions from associated travel. I switched my electricity provider to a wind/small-scale-hydro company. These are small steps; my emissions are still about half of the average Canadian's (i.e., about five times as much as the average Indian's). I want to hear stories that give me ideas about other ways I can reduce my impact. I do not want to hear stories that, despite all we know about climate change, result in a perpetuation of the status quo.

There is nothing inspirational, and certainly nothing heroic about this post. I don't presume that MJO did anything other than make the decision he thought was best for his family. I just don't want to read about it.

You say to a commenter "most of our need for a car is for heavy stuff - groceries, lumber, etc."

GROCERIES!!?? After an occasional dishwasher and lumber, you come up with groceries?? You must be stocking up for the next wave of environmental disasters.

[yes, groceries; our experience is that many people in cities buy cars for two reasons - transporting laundry and groceries. Taxis, buses, Zipcar, etc. just don't cut it in the long run. mjo]

we make decisions for our family first; is this much different from every other human on the planet? mjo

maybe. But safety is not a rational issue - it's a perceived one. it's pretty powerful too - your senses are telling you something mjo

Congrats, you're actually proud of the fact that you fell for all of the marketing bs that we have been working our arses off putting the word out that it is all bs. Why don't you just come out and say it... "But the marketing was cool and the gadgets were shiny" I don't know what makes me more sick. The actual purchase I believe could be justified, just not by you. I think I'm more disgusted by the fact that you seem proud that you don't give a damn about anything this site acted like it was supposed to be about. When someone finds a new site that deserves to call themselves treehugger let me know, these guys obviously don't anymore.

First of all, I want to honestly thank you for sharing your experience and thoughts on the matter, and to stick around and defend yourself.
I am very conflicted in this issue because although I wish I could be entirely earth-friendly I know I never can be. My new objective is to be as earth-friendly as I can be, and to constantly make small changes to get there.
I wish, like many of the other posters, that you had arrived at a different decision. It makes me happy to hear of people who do good for the environment and are totally satisfied and happy. Some of the reasoning you used makes me a bit angry, but other comments have already addressed that.
I think it's too bad you cannot serve as a green inspiration in this facet, but I'm glad that you shared your experience for all of us who struggle with greening our lives.
Do think about it, and you can always trade it in.

This post has been a great distraction after a long day of work...

I decided to purchase a 4X4 pickup truck early this year; since I usually drive alone I don't NEED the extra seating a car has.

Since I heat my house primarily with felled wood it has made sense for me to pick up a load every chance I get.

I guess if for some chance I NEED to cart around some other people I can rent a Prius or some other fashionable vehicle for a day.

As for safety- I fell secure I will be able to heat my house and survive the cold.

I'm sorry but this post reeks of, "HEY EVERYBODY! LOOK AT ME! I JUST BOUGHT A NEW CAR!."

Show your neighbors, show your mom but this is just lame not to mention what others have pointed out.

I bought a 3 year-old Kia Spectra5 that gets 30-35mpg, not the best but better than most non-hybrids. It has a 60K mile warranty, and I can fit 8' 2x4's in it. I can also fit groceries, 5 people (yes I've done it), and 2 windsurfing boards, 3 masts, 5 sails and 2 booms INSIDE!

The only time I wished I had something else is when I need to haul dirt, or bark-o-mulch.

@frontier
I don't feel sorry for Mark being lectured by anyone, he chose to post his choice of buying this vehicle knowing that he would get blasted. This idea that you can be concerned about the environment only when it is convenient for you, just doesn't cut it. Mark knew what he was walking into....

Hello.

You know this is hypocrisy.

You know that if a family of /3/ can justify this, so can almost anyone else. You might as well update all your previous posts that were ever critical of the SUV mindset and explain how you were wrong.

I have never felt so disgusted reading TreeHugger.

Civilly and critically,
Richard

And that click is the sound of Treehugger being removed from my RSS reader...

I get that you like your new car....

Thanks.

Really.

I write from Poland and I started readring treahugger knowing that is one of the bests eco-blogs. Not a month after subscribing I see so much hipocrisy.

Writing all this stuff about caring about hte environment and buying later an SUV is the same case like a doctor who talks about cancer and smoking 20 cigarettes a day.

Either your BMI is abouve 30 or somebody showed you a mini version of Prius. How can you say that it hasn't got enough space for a family of 3? You should see how people in Poland cope having 4 kids and toyota yaris.

For me its only boasting "I have new car. Reading my website allowed me to buy it."

It seems as if this post brings out a deeper issue than even MJO was intending.

Lets pretend we do have a shinny green world in the future. The tone of the comments left on this post reveal that that future will still have judgmentalism and fear.

The life of an environmentalist is a tough one. It is a call to forsake our selfish desires (even the desire to judge others) in favor of the community of life. When it comes to living simply there are motes of dust and planks in each of our eyes.

I have not yet mastered the art of living simply, but I hope to master the art of encouragement.

Making a judgment is different that judging another person. One is objective the other is moralizing.

What an absolute sell out - this is the sort of facile, self-serving nonsense argument we've come to expect from people who have been busily driving the earth into the ground, you should be ashamed of yourself. This sort of ridiculous Mea Culpa is just embarrassing it doesn't get you off the hook - what a great ambassador for Treehugger. I know I'll be checking who has written articles from now on - there's evidently a variable amount of conviction in the TH ranks.

Ok, if Mark didn't feel real good sting in hes heart after buying the Honda. Most of these comments can really give that.

Still, have to join the chorus. Weak argument points.

There are loads of alternatives that are better from both environment and safety point of view.

Gotta to love the car options here in Europe.

Cars are probably one of the hardest things to buy. Personally I really do enjoy owning a car for the freedom it gives you, but same time I can't feel anything but guilt using it. (even though I drive Renault Twingo - a really smal car)

its funny how many people are willing to point a finger. I just think that its going to take more than every person making a small difference or a majority of people having the power to change things. I know that sounds crazy, but HEAR me out on this. I'm trying to emphasize a point.

I think that the world on a whole is on the track toward sustainability. But, I think the ultimate change that needs to happen is in a person in their own mind. I think that a fundamental change has to happen to change how people relate to each other. A sense of community building will be more valuable than a bunch of people being lone rangers criticizing everyone elses decisions. I just think its too easy to do. Stick to helpful, respectful criticism. Encouragement always goes farther than discouragement. Green should mean being positive as much as it is about being environmentally sustainable.

Just my two cents.

What a bunch of lame-ass excuses. You "need" an SUV for 3 people? When I was a kid in the 70's my parents drove a 2 door VW bug and we kids sat in the back seat - I was not traumatized. Why do people need more room nowadays?

"TreeHugger"? Apparently just a bunch of greenwash. Sounds to me like Mark went to a car dealer and got hit by a very good salesman and now he's trying to justify his mistake.

Come on, you run a blog called "TreeHugger", one would hope you could set a better example.

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/06/the_only_good_s.php

Kudos on full disclosure. However, your reasoning doesn't make a lot of sense.

You state that the decision to buy the CR-V was because you might need to haul around extra family and/or dishwashers. Hmmm. The CR-V and the Prius carry exactly the same number of passengers, plus the Prius has more headroom and legroom than the CR-V for the driver. So it looks like you'll still need to rent that van, or else buy a Tahoe.

Like other posters I was taken aback by your, "The biggest car in a crash wins," philosophy. That kind of reasoning is partially responsible for the behemoths we have on the road today. A decision based on fear is usually a poor decision.

You definitely don't do much for my faith in new media.

Couldn't you hire a car when you needed to carry something big? All the other good stuff you may do gets cancelled out by buying this brand new BIG piece of kit so I wonder is this just to get a bit of drama going? Are you serious? What are doing one this website?

is this some kind of joke where you wish to see how readers respond?

well i'll play along. there is no need to buy an SUV there is plenty of choice available

misleading - it's not about the size of the engine, necessarily, it is more about the weight of the car where a car tends to use more fuel and SUV's have height. these things are unnecessarily tall, they feed into our stereotypes, the people who tend to drive these cars are insecure in them selves they're higher than the rest of humanity, perched on their thrones thinking they are actually safer.

safety - the SUV finds it difficult to achieve full ncap 5 star rating because if you hit someone they are more likely to die of suffer severe injury due to the height of the bumper, this is as disrespectful of me puffing smoke into your face.

choice - it is a personal choice that has a direct impact on the environment, not just pollution but visual impact, the car is taller and it blocks pedestrians visible space, SUV's should be completely band from the built environment for this reason alone, they are designed to look aggressive and hostile and so this creates a hostile environment, we make choices personally that have an impact on others.

disappointed - what does treehugger stand for now? what a silly move. clearly wrong by the response of readers, ARE YOU GOING TO GIVE IT BACK?

Couldn't you hire a car when you needed to carry something big? All the other good stuff you may do gets cancelled out by buying this brand new BIG piece of kit so I wonder is this just to get a bit of drama going? Are you serious? What are doing one this website?

Disappointing.

I'm guilty of some wasteful practices myself, but every time I buy something or do something new I have the chance to do it right. Like working it out so I can work from home to save on commuting. getting a bike so I can get groceries and do other common trips on that instead of the car. When my roommate moved out and took the fridge I bought the smallest most efficient one I could find. Paying extra for green electricity and so the utility company can invest in new alternative energy sources. switching to LED and CFl lighting and more importantly, turning the lights off when they aren't needed.

I hate to be a preachy holier than thou type but every decision that informed people who care about the planet make from here on out makes a difference. Buying the most efficient thing you can or not buying something you don't need is the best most of us can do. Especially from a person who writes for this site I find it a bit hypocritical and your reasons a little weak.

but whatever, I bet more than half the people here flaming you have a higher carbon footprint than you.

My point is that you all make me sick, especially me :)

I would have fixed the old one, unless it was a suburban or something. For one thing, $1500 is a lot less than a new SUV Crossover, and it's probably a lot less wasteful as well.

I'm disgusted, and I'll be taking my ad views with me. You guys have been going downhill for a while, but this takes the cake.

I'm sorry, but for those of us who actually do have families and sacrifice, this is ridiculous. Goodbye, Treehugger.

I would have to agree with the other posters as well, I'm disappointed that this was deemed worthy of this site.

Bestialisch!

I stay in the same wave as Nick: You don't need a SUV!
and if you leave in the town, why don't you do share a car wenn you muss to transport a dishwasher?

Full, but really really blamed!

Wow - this is such a first world bitch session. I currently live in Bangalore, India - instead of wasting precious time and energy denigrating this man on his choice (yes, choice) and, mjo, instead of hemming and hawing over your choice and blaming your wife for it (yes i did get that sense from your posts), could you PLEASE start trying to influence the American govt and American people to actually DO something about the impending climate crisis?? What we need now is not self-indulgent, apologising (i'm sorry i broke down and bought a BIG car) or blustering or boasting (my prius is better than your vue, etc etc) but some really meaningful policy change. and behavior change. I love the way Bush blames people in India for the food crisis (ie, our growing middle class is eating more meat, driving more cars) but hey, what about you guys, you Americans?

This article is the perfect example of American hypocrisy. We can't tell wants from needs. I just read somewhere that SUV accidents account for something like 35% of all accidents but 55% of all deaths. I'm guessing at numbers. I wish I could recall the study.

And as for cargo examples: please, most places that sell large items offer free or cheap DISHWASHER delivery. My parents did fine with 4 kids in a sedan.

Treehugger should be called Greenwasher.com when they post these "news items".

No matter what vehicle you use, bike , car , SUV it should be made not to kill the driver/passenger Most SUV's and crossovers are so heavy, they crush their roof and kill. Enjoy all that extra room!

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2008/05/roof_crush.html

http://www.suvrollovernews.com/html/general.html

Pragmatism get things done, it doesn't them progress. It's the reason people still worship petrol. Yes it practical, but it is far from ideal. Also, most of your arguments are based on perceived benefitas opposed to real benefit (I have more seats - nope, you need extra seats, you need extra room - how tall are you 8'? I have room for dishwasher - you buy one everyday of course, they're safer - nope). So you in your pragmatism you have chosen to be seduced be something that is not necessarily more beneficial to you.

Seats - there are smaller cars with 5 seats or more
Room - estates have plenty of room and if you really do need haul a dishwasher with you, there are such things as trailers, as others have mentioned
Safety - the Prius has the best child safety rating ever given by NCAP, Volvos in general have very good safety.
Cost - in the Europe at least, SUVs experience the fastest rate of depreciation of any car. Obviously fuel and insurance costs are greater (and taxes and tolls in some places). Also, due to the heavier nature of the vehicles parts tend to wear more quickly and so do not last as long.

Ultimately, if you were convinced that your decision was the correct one, you wouldn't have felt the need to justify to us. That you feel the need to simulate an interrogation and provide arguments based on perceived as opposed to real benefits shows how hollow your reckoning is.

Sorry, I don't like to slate people - but really, be honest about your motivations. You may not be doing it to keep up with trends, but you've bought into the SUV invincible "lets smite all other road users" mindset. You made a very, very, selfish choice that you think (wrongly) will protect your family and to hell with anyone else whose lives might be impacted by that (or more importantly anyone impacted by your vehicle). Not only have you placed your perceived safety above the real safety of others, you have placed your perceived convenience over the environment.

pity - I used to like reading this site...

A few years ago, when SUV weren't hype, every family of three or even four didn't use trucks because "cars were too small".

In the past five years, I also moved a few times dishwashers, washing machines, drums,... using my trusty and rusty Renault 5, an old European Yaris-like car, and eveytime the hatch closed. Come on, how often do you use your car to move a dishwasher ?

[it's about 20/80 for hauling mjo]

MJO, you simply published with this post your failure to live what you preach, using only "emotional" arguments when the facts show lots of better alternatives (eco-wise, but security-wise too).

By the way, blaming your wife isn't the smartest move, maybe it would have been better to think on how you could improve your arguments to convince her.

[you're right mjo]

I suggest that everyone unsuscribe, maybe the loss of readership will show that writing green isn't enough to call himself a Treehugger, you have to act green too.

PS: Theresa H comment: priceless :-)
PPS: Maybe this post is just a prank ? If it is, very bad move too...

While the CRV is hardly the worst SUV your arguments are weak. A decent supermini could do all you need, including the dishwasher....

I totally get your point. I live in a semi-rural area of southern Oregon. We get snow around the mountains, so I needed 4WD or at least AWD. I looked around quite a bit, took many things into consideration, including trying to piece together the footprint of the manufacturing and where most of the jobs were for making the vehicle.

After a very thorough research, I ended up with the Chevy Equinox. I telecommute and my son walks to school, so I only have to fill half my tank once per month. I'm getting 20.12 miles per gallon and I plan to give the car to my son when he goes off to college in 4 years.

I wish I could have gone with a hybrid. I checked into the Saturn Vue, but it was hardly any difference in gas millage and it had a much bigger environmental impact.

All we can do is make informed choices. That's what I did, and it sounds like that's what you did too.

I was shocked to read this.

I agree with your readers who conclude that you should have bought a diesel wagon if you really thought you needed the space.

Your justifications on your need for "perceived security" are really weak.

If this website really stands for something you should resign.

OK, I'm calling BS on this.

You simply made a bet with someone that you could get the greatest number of responses with a posting. You came up with this nonsense to win that beer, right?

'cause, like I said above (buried in the deluge), otherwise this would be seriously kooky behavior. So much so, you'd very much need to seek professional help.

refrigerator, lumber, =delivery. you R wimping out!
and as for calling yourself a treehugger sorry that doesn't fly for your type.

I'll try this again, maybe without the "hilarious" this time?

[better mjo]

It makes a difference if mjo is an editor or manager or a decision maker within Treehugger or if he is a freelancer or regular writer.

If he is a decision maker within Treehugger then walking the walk should be an integral part of his life. The decision makers at Treehugger expect to make money from our click through traffic. They want our eyeballs on their website so they can charge more for their ads. If they are not walking the walk, then why would we be inclined to return to this site when there are so many other green sites out there by obviously serious Treehuggers?

If he is a freelancer or regular writer, then more power to him. He does not have the same responsibility within Treehugger. He has only his own personal reputation to think of and if that does not include walking the walk then that is completely up to him. Maybe he sees himself as being "a writer" and not "a Green writer". That is up to him.

[I'm a writer about environmentally-related issues mjo]

Even so, posting an article like this and then getting defensive is "interesting".

Right, so you want safety.
What if everyone want to buy a car bigger than their neighbor's. Should everyone get a tank? Think about it.
Anyone want a big car for safety is just another victim of car manufacturer marketing strategy.
May those die slowly because of this climate change.

Wow so instead of buying one of the Hybrid SUV's you got a regualr one? Wow That is sooooo screwed up. This person should be kicked off the site.

[We looked at the Pathfinder - it was way out of our budget mjo]

Really disappointed. I must say.

3 kids would fit comfortably into a Prius, or a Yaris. If they can't, plan better. If families of 10 in India can get around on a donkey and a few bicycles, then you don't need an SUV.

Terribly weak arguments leading to a poorly justified decision. Did you also invest in Chevron while you were doing this?

[Authors edit: at first I wondered if this was indeed an "Intelligent and civil comment", and I think it is. Its a fair criticism intended to make the article's author reconsider his decision. Treehugger makes me reconsider all sorts of things everyday, and i fell it fair to criticize the SUV decision as sharply as possible.]

Hi All,

First, thanks for the comments and the civility, they have generally been great.

This is the first time we have not felt great about a car purchase; this was both surprising and disappointing for us. I wrote this post in an effort to convey our supreme difficultly in choosing amongst the available options; we found that each vehicle we looked at had many of the options we wanted, but none had all of them. I surmised that perhaps others were experiencing the same issue, and indeed some of you are.

Some felt we fell victim to our emotions, especially for the safety and comfort. I agree these are difficult, but are a necessary part of the equation along with mileage, warranties, emissions, and price. Our experience was each and every vehicle was competitive in its own right; when you are offered a two-year old SUV for $8995, your mind might do some crazy things.

As many pointed out, it seems like I'm am rationalizing and justifying; I feel like I am explaining. Without sitting down for a cup of coffee with each you, this can be difficult in a forum.

it 'felt' safer?!? Sometimes you just need to transport a dishwasher? What, like, once in a lifetime? This is a total cop-out. SUVs have no more space than a wagon. I'm deeply moved by the sympathy from people with a family of 5 (again SUVs don't transport those better than a wagon). You have a family of 3. You obviously only have principles as and when it suits you. Nice.

[Cargo is about 20 percent of the miles for us. Is the family of 5 more principled? mjo]

Great article. Obviously you struggled with this decision, and obviously you are feeling a little bit guilty, or at least a little bit of buyer's remorse. Thanks for sharing, and welcome to the real world. I think the comments of all the hostile, insensitive posters are of great value too. They point out, for me anyway, how the uber-environmentalist fringe can be just as dangerous to our future health and welfare as Big Oil, clueless governments, and greedy people in general.
You are, most definitely, NOT part of "the problem", and that is good enough for me. Now, if you could indulge me, just a little bit of Monday morning quarterbacking: I think people buy WAY too many new cars, which I think may be perpetuating a lot of consumption trends that would be best avoided. Since you use your vehicle so little, you AND the environment may have been better served by a high miles, highly depreciated vehicle which might have saved you a lot on tax and insurance, might have caused one less vehicle to be manufactured, and might have saved a little space in a landfill somewhere.

[We are a 1-car family. We bought used, and plan to keep this one for a long time. Also not happy about the car just sitting around losing value - it's about $1300 per year just in depreciation mjo]

Come ON people! Just because it is an SUV does not make it a bad choice. MJO only drive 6000 miles a year, and that is 3 people total. Usually, in more of the USA there are 2 adults driving 12,000 miles a year so that would be 24,000 miles so MJO's family is only driving 1/4th of the typical milage an average american drives and it is a CRV that is a ULEV vehicle so the emissions are most likely better then whatever they happened to be driving before because the check engine light 9 times out of 10 is usually results in worse emissions. It is not like he bought an H3 or something. If your whole family only drives 6000 miles or less a year AND you have quite a bit of heavy hauling that you use the car for and you still only bought one car that was a prius instead of buying something that was more sane for your situation then YOU are the only one that should attack MJO for the decision. I for one applaud the decision as well thought out. My wife and i are also weighing the decision of replacing my car with either a new small car like a Prius or something bigger like a small SUV CRV or an Element as we love to tent camp in the summer and our gear fills up her civic sedan or my kia optima such that we don't have room for ourselves really. The only reason we are talking about a bigger car for me is that i drive about 1500 miles a year, just m-f around 6 miles a day to and from work.
-t

I am glad that you put this out here for us to see your decision, but I am truly disappointed as you are a Treehugger. I can see that this decision is obviously haunting you, and that you have a spouse, and I know how that goes, but since you are preaching Save the Planet to everyone else, we thought that maybe you might actually have been trying to do it yourself.

I guess there's always next time to buy another car...if were not flooded by then.

I don't think that purchasing a new car, even an SUV, is necessarily wrong, but the reasons given for the purchase were weak and the defensive interjections by the author in the comments seems uncalled for (and unprofessional). I don't expect Treehugger writers to be perfect, but I also don't want to come here and read the same anti-environmental excuses for decisions that I hear everyday from people around me more concerned about what they want than what is right to do.

This type of post (and way of looking at environmental decisions), with it's fact-less analysis, flawed logic, and constant rationalization, makes me unsure whether I can or should trust other Treehugger content, and less likely to read the site in the future when I'm looking for good environmental insight.

While I do agree with a lot of the posters who think that MJO is simply trying to justify his way out of feeling guilty about not making the best eco choice he could, I think folks are being pretty harsh.

For example, the person who cites bringing a china cabinet from Salem OR to SF in a Prius could have just paid for it to be shipped in a truck with a lot of other goods, a prius does not justify that round-trip drive. I find that many prius/hybrid drivers feel that they've got license to drive more miles because it's a hybrid. If MJO drives only 6000 miles a year and hypermiles all 6K miles in his CRV, he's probably still ahead of my friends with priuses who drive to work every day, never take public transportation and feel like they're environmental saints.

@tea: Yes, the comments may be harsh for some who just claims to be a treehugger, but for someone who is supposed to be a rolemodel and report on environmental issues, it feels like downright betrayal.

[Make the same series of really hard choices, then write about it. Perhaps you will find it's not as simple as 'Buy A Prius'. mjo]

Almost anywhere you can buy appliances offers free delivery and even free installation. The "I need it because I buy a lot of appliances" argument is moot.

But I totally understand the dilemma of having a wife who's not as treehugger as you are, though mine thought that the Matrix (or Pontiac Vibe) was perfect. It's a little big for my tastes.

It really is non-trivial for a mother (or a father) to walk half a mile or more while transporting a child, a personal bag with food and/or bottle(s) and diapers and wipes, AND a child safety seat -- to the location of a Zipcar. If you have a stroller, perhaps you try to sling the car seat over your shoulder while not steering the stroller into the street.

If you don't, you have to figure out how to contain a small child in a parking lot or loose in a car while you fumble away with straps attempting to get the carseat correctly tied down.

I have been racking my brains trying to get a solution to this.

(incidentally, my family of 3 maintains Zipcar memberships because it gives us access to occasional truck use and daytrips from work for my carless spouse; the Honda CRV we have hasn't been big enough to handle cargo such as boxed appliances, or loads of mulch.)

You say ... "But as it turned out, these vehicles didn't fit our needs."

Well, a packed 737 with no legroom and inflexible schedule doesn't fit my needs, so I'll opt for the Cessna Citation on my next trip.

I support your decision, but of course, it will be construed, rightly so as "do as I say, not as I do". We live in a market driven economy and this is what happens when options are available to choose from.

This article is a fairly well-written, but unconvincing, apology for a lamentable decision. Hey, it's your life, and your choice, but by the very act of posting your story, you seem to be asking other treehuggers for endorsement, for us to accept your feeble rationalizations. No dice.

[seems so mjo]

How often do you tote dishwashers around? Have you ever thought about asking for the help of a friend/neighbor who has a truck, and doing a reciprocal favor? Isn't that what treehugging is all about: pooling existing resources, reducing consumption, scaling back?

[now I am the guy with the resource mjo]

I think you've bought into the fear and "me first" thinking of our consumerist culture. You offer no data on, but just a vague "feeling" about, the SUV's supposed safety:

"I don't know why this is exactly; you are up a little higher, it is heavier; you sort of feel that if you get hit, mass will be on your side."

Could it be because you've swallowed the hype?

By the way, according to energy efficiency expert Ampry Lovins, there is NO correlation between the weight of a car and its safety.

Bigger cars ARE safer. Heavier cars are not.

The Rocky Mountain Institute has designed a crossover sized car out of light materials, so it is big and light; safe and efficient.

I must add one thing that I see constantly on Treehugger and really really grates at me.

My number one pet peeve is city dwellers who tell people its unconscionable to live in the country because city life is SO much greener. Yes, SO green that by virtue of living in one with a family of three the purchase of an SUV is necessitated--give me a break. I'll ride my bike down the country roads all i want while you guzzle a few gallons to transport all that lumber and all those dishwashers a couple miles. I know people will disagree with me on this but I have to say it since I don't see that perspective represented here often enough.

Oh and, there's also this thing called "delivery," in which businesses deliver large appliances to the homes of non SUV owning customers. They'll even bring it inside!

What the hey? I drive a car which is more than suitable for a family of four not three.

Here it is:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_Micra#K12C_.282007.E2.80.93present.29

I get about 3.8litres of diesel per 100kms. I think the idea of getting an SUV is just crazy. My car has 4 stars on European crash tests. SUVs make me sick.

Maybe this has already been added but the right small car has a lot of space. I am partial to VW, but my golf seats 5 (I am 6ft 3in and fit in the back), the seats fold down (I have never put a dishwasher in it, but lots of other big stuff fits) and it gets over 30mpg (not super great, but better than any SUV).

Note from the editor: The comments for this post were temporarily turned off but have been turned back on.

[people, this is a long thread; please read it before posting. If you find you can add something, great, but try to avoid duplication. As usual, the non-intelligent and non-civil postings will be removed mjo]

How I would love to be positive about your choice. It is certainly true that a Honda CRV is a good choice overall and is not a gas hog... but your "old" vehicle only had 75,000 miles on it and was suffering from what? a check engine light? Here is what I would have done:
1) buy a vacuum guage and check the vacuum in each of the cylinders - cost about $50 and anyone can learn how in an hour or less.
2) Give the vehicle a tune up or pay a shop to do it. At least identify the fatal flaw that your vehicle has. A red idiot light does not a faulty vehicle make.

[the shop did these things - did a smoke test, reset the computer, changed a fuel valve, cleaned the air sensor. Unfortunately you cant pass inspection in MA with a check engine light on. mjo]

The best way we can all become more green is by learning to repair and maintain what we have instead of joining the throw it away and buy something new crowd. Perhaps you can buy a Chiltons repair manual for your CRV and read through it like you would a good book. The mystery under the hood does not have to be a source of fear for anyone. Great site & keep up the excellent work!

The 2008 CR-V gets decent mileage, 20 in the city and 26 on the highway, but the Prius makes that look really bad at 48 city and 45 highway. You can compare both these cars on my site, hybridvsgas.com. It's definitely a personal choice, but with gas prices still on the rise, and oil at over $134/barrel our choices may be getting much more limited.

-

When Treehugger buys an SUV “because if felt safer” even though he KNOWS it isn't, then we see why those who aren't so green informed tend to buy these guzzlers.
Rationalize it all ya want, they got ya Treehugger, and every time you ride your SUV, look in the mirror, you will know why our environment in in trouble.

At least you bought one of the less obnoxious SUVs.

the best thing you can do for the environment transportation-wise does not have to do with what kind of car you buy, but with moving closer to work. Mark has already done this - he works from home and his wife uses public transportation. the criticism regarding his choice of vehicle is unfair - if we all averaged 6,000 miles per year we'd do a lot more to cut emissions than if we all switched over to hybrids, clean diesels, etc.

MJO, Respond to the questions about carshare, like Zip.

I would be worried about a sustainable business consultant that didn't even contemplate something like the functional sales/service economy alternative.

[cmon, read the thread mjo]

Alright.

I agree with the Crossover purchase.
They may, still be SUV's, but it's better than buying a suburban.
CR-V's get about 25 MPG.
Not the best, but not terrible.
I mean, it's better than a PT Cruiser! (20mpg)
And to the person going on about getting a Matrix, they get 25mpg. THE SAME as a CR-V. I know this from personal experience: my step mother has one.

I think the CR-V was a good choice.
It's a small SUV that doesn't get 10MPG.

I have to say that I find the almost blanket condemnation you are getting over this purchase a little ridiculous.

It seems to me that your habits are a lot like mine, the car is parked during the week while you and your spouse, much like mine use public transit to get around everywhere. We live in a city with an excellent metro system and horrible traffic.

Once or twice a week you need to get to the store or to home depot or two your parents house, or to collect the furniture you find on the street and plan to recover and restore, and usually these trips require space. That’s when you use the car, so when people make the argument "how often do you need the space" they have missed the point, we primarily only use the car when 'we need the space.' I have a 92 accord that I intend to drive into the ground before I get a new vehicle and it is great on gas but I can't even get a chair into it without some complex maneuvering and putting a dent in the ceiling when I had to get it out. Plus we tried to put some roof racks on it but the roof design didn’t actually allow it. Having a CRV, (which considering it’s gas mileage and size is more of a jacked up sedan in my opinion) seems like a reasonable idea. Blanket condemnation of a car because of its type is silly, you condemn a car based on its statistics, 25mpg does not a gas guzzler make.

While I agree that a hybrid SUV might have been a better choice.. it is possible that you decided a car company with a history of longevity to its vehicles was a better idea. Is it likely that the ford hybrid will have a better maintenance rating then other members of the ford family... I doubt it.

On a side not I would also say that anyone who drives more then 6000km a year really shouldn’t be throwing any stones in this discussion. Plus people need to remember that this article isn’t supposed to be a justification, it is an article about the real life choices that someone had to make.

Plus last time I checked it was illegal to ride a donkey around town.

[omg, you may have a second career as a mind reader, because you inferred every single point that I had in this posting. mjo]

Give your affirmation of Dan's post, I'll try again:

Comments have said:

"Why didn't you join zipcar or another car-sharing service? They offer minivans and pick-ups for exactly the situations you mention here...If you really don't drive that much, and you live in an urban area (as you wrote you do), car-sharing makes a lot more sense (and can be a LOT cheaper) than buying/owning a car. I'm curious why you didn't address this...
May 19, 2008 5:25 PM

"Boston has zipcar, which means you need a truck for something you got it, for an hour or 24.
May 19, 2008 5:58 PM

On this, your only response has been:
"[yes, groceries; our experience is that many people in cities buy cars for two reasons - transporting laundry and groceries. Taxis, buses, Zipcar, etc. just don't cut it in the long run. mjo]
May 19, 2008 11:14 PM"

Please provide a more comprehensive response: does 'cut it' refer to financial, convenience, sustainability?

Or are you merely concurring with the much more useful comment (and insightful sustainable design brief) by neshura (which would imply you have toddler-aged kids):

"It really is non-trivial for a mother (or a father) to walk half a mile or more while transporting a child, a personal bag with food and/or bottle(s) and diapers and wipes, AND a child safety seat -- to the location of a Zipcar. If you have a stroller, perhaps you try to sling the car seat over your shoulder while not steering the stroller into the street.
If you don't, you have to figure out how to contain a small child in a parking lot or loose in a car while you fumble away with straps attempting to get the carseat correctly tied down.
I have been racking my brains trying to get a solution to this.
(incidentally, my family of 3 maintains Zipcar memberships because it gives us access to occasional truck use and daytrips from work for my carless spouse; the Honda CRV we have hasn't been big enough to handle cargo such as boxed appliances, or loads of mulch.)
May 20, 2008 10:45 AM

[now this is a great question, because it really gets to the root of the issue. So, the question is about Zipcar with three items - financial, convenience, sustainability.

Financially, Zipcar is not cheap; $9-11 an hour, or $75-85 a day. This is more expensive than a typical company such as Enterprise, which can deliver the vehicle to your door, and they are often $29 a day on weekends when Zipcar costs more. So, I find their business model to be less efficient.

Convenience-wise, the nearest car to us is about a mile away. Similar to the lady in the above posting, we can find no easy way to cover that distance on a regular basis.

Sustainability has no formalized definition, but I'll try and answer anyway. Zipcar probably has trained mechanics to maintain their fleet which will prolong their life; I think this is a plus, however, I doubt you will find a Zipcar more than a few years old (people won't rent them), and you certainly won't find one that's a junker and unsafe to drive. We keep our car in excellent condition as well. The car sharing idea is definitely a good idea, and Zipcar is implementing it well. This is detracted from somewhat as I believe (no proof) that rentals are usually abused more than owned cars.

Zipcar is a business; they buy and place cars to turn a profit, by filling a void in transportation requirements for a lot of people. With their changing rates on the weekends, it's clear that there is a strong profit motive, which I don't think detracts in any way from their service - good for them. Ultimately though, we were outside their targeted audience.

mjo]

He got a CRV it's more a minivan then an SUV though an actual mini van also is a good and often neglected option.
Though if you want a real SUV there is the hybrid Yukon
pricey but if you really feel you need a real truck it does get decent millage about 22mpg 50% better then non hybrids in it's size class.
Though one thing that is often missing in todays offerings for people who just want a little more cargo capacity is the station wagon though vehicles like the Chevy HHR and Scion Xb partly fill this and are good choices.

mjo - you are a treehugger staffer. You don't call yourself a "green writer" but a "writer on environmental issues"
mjo - you live in-town Boston (I live in MA, know the traffic, the climate, the laws)
mjo - your wife rides the bus to work, you telecommute, you drive 6000k/yr [miles mjo]
mjo - you have a family of three
mjo - you don't like VWs, Saturns
mjo - you actually test drove a Prius, but decided it didn't fit your "needs"
mjo - you buy a lot of stuff that needs transporting (or maybe you sell/trade/donate said stuff, I don't know)
mjo - you didn't write your article for people who lived and breathed the tree-hugging life, looking for inspiration to make better decisions than they had in the past, people who already know how easy it is to justify every decision, but want to do better next time, people who try to lead by example which is better than 1000 words (I just read this on the treehugger site today - in the article about the environmental award winning people either fighting Chevron/Texaco in the Amazon or trying to save severe soil erosion in Mexico - very, very inspirational)
mjo - you wrote your article for those real, actual people who had real lives, who had to make real decisions about car buying, people who had to make real life decisions, about their safety and their families - you know, for all those real people out there, those real people out there working, and living and dying in this real world, not for those silly Prius loving treehuggers, but REAL PEOPLE making REAL DECISIONS. These are the people who are making the important decisions about the environment anyway, and who vote in Presidents and everything. It's all for the real people who have to make those practical real decisions in this world.

I read every posting, and I reread your original self-interview several times to clarify every point.

I am sitting here and my eyes keep tearing up, because I feel I have to post this comment, and I know you''ll make some comment like "I hope you don't sacrifice too much" or something like you did to one poster.

I - am a married, 51 mother of 2 college grads
I - drive a 14 yo mini-van with a check engine light on that has to pass inspection in Sept. but I have no commute and it is handy for large purchases, and for really large items we rent a U-haul open trailer for $14. If the van costs too much to fix, I should think about pre-ordering another Prius soon. There isn't a lot of choice out there today
My husband - drives an '04 Prius (over 53mpgs per fill-up) to work in Maine twice a week.
My daughter - drives an '00 Saturn SC2 (runs well and she wants to buy a Prius when she gets out of grad school. Her car is way too low, even for her, and she feels SO much safer in our mini-van
My son - who lives in-town Portland, Maine walked to work for 2 years, but recently bought my husband's '02 Passat that had a recall for a sludge issue years ago, it has 100k on it, and no problems at all. He is 6'1" and complains about the lack of extra head room sitting in the back seat of the Prius, but the leg room is fine. We always forget to let him drive, the rest of us are 5'6, 5'8 and 5'11 and don't mind sitting back there.
I - have MS and while I can no longer garden on my back hill without mostly crawling, I am making bio-logs by twining together cut stems from overgrown trees and bushes in our yard, to prevent soil erosion and help preserve rain to water new plantings on the severely dry hill. We have a large patch that will just not support any growth, and I had given up on it, but then I found this link on the treehugger website. I wish I had found it 16 years ago when we moved in. There wasn't a blade of grass or even a tree, barely a few inches of top soil on over an acre. But I have planted native plants, built rock walls, a little drought-tolerant grass and lots of ground covers. Bio-logs are the best solution all around (soil conservation vs burning the stems, or shredding them in our gas powered chipper shredder)

I have lived this tree-hugger life, but now I think I will rethink my love for this website. I am wasting precious time on my computer. I just bought a new energy efficient laptop. But I still have 2 months to decide if I want to keep it.

I think you have helped me more than you'll ever know. I will sleep on it, but I really should decide, one way or another, about getting solar panels for the roof, and really limiting my use of electricity by shutting off this stupid computer and walking the walk even more instead of doing a lot of reading by people like you who are just talking the talk.

Boy - I kind of feel like I've been a little too gullible at this website. I'll live. At my age, nothing surprises me.

Hey, thanks for everything. It's been real. Enjoy your new great deal on that SUV crossover. WHAT a deal!

[thanks for the honesty mjo]

2 of my most key points were left out in my previous post - I was interrupted while reading it over and rush posted it (we had to drive our old van to trade cars with our daughter's saturn - she's moving this weekend and this van comes in handy, but then so does the Prius)

POINT 1 - I said: "My daughter - drives an '00 Saturn SC2 (runs well and she wants to buy a Prius when she gets out of grad school. Her car is way too low, even for her, and she feels SO much safer in our mini-van"

I meant to add: BUT she feels just as safe driving the Prius, because it rides so much higher up than many cars.

She loves the Prius, and took a course at Clark University about the environment, and finally understood why I ordered it 6 months in advance back in 2004. She "loves" her Saturn, it was her first car. But she LOVES everything about the Prius. She actually has gotten better mileage driving it on long trips than I have on the same routes, the brat ;-). My husband used to call us liars that we routinely got 53 mpgs on our long commutes to college from home base (per tankfull) Now he drives the Prius to Maine since selling his Passat to my son, and he took a picture with his phone/camera the first time he got over 54mpg per tankful, not just 1 or 2 legs of a trip, but multiple highway trips and city/backroad driving. Now he complains about people at work who don't believe HE gets over 54 mpg every day/all day, even though he shows them the picture. EVERYONE LIES ABOUT the ACTUAL CAR MILEGE THEIR CARS GET, but our experiences with the Prius are what they are and they are so real.

POINT 2 - I said: "I - am a married, 51 (add YEAR OLD) mother of 2 college grads"

I meant to also add: which means that I had ample experience moving the kids in and out of dorm rooms, then apartments for the last 7 years - every 6 months for 6 years - OMG. Yes the van was helpful, but it is amazing what you can get in the Prius. My husband always said "that won't fit" and I proved him wrong OVER and OVER and OVER. Not queen size mattresses, but you can keep stuffing it in.

I will miss the mini-van when we finally decide to stop putting money into it, but it is 14 years old, we are not mechanics, and it is in good enough shape that someone might be able to put it to some use or not, whatever. Everything dies.

POINT 3 - But the Prius is addictive. It is my zen car. I use to be a very aggressive driver, and now if I have to drive anywhere, I relax and just enjoy the ride, because the more I relax, the better gas mileage I get. It's a win/win situation.

When I replace the van, we will look for better alternatives, and I hope there are more (even better) options. But overall, ALL things considered, the Prius is simply the only game in town today. I haven't regretted for a second getting it. My husband finally has accepted it totally as well. His Passat used premium gas, it's a standard (so 30mpgs). I never understood why he didn't by a 2002 Prius, but it was the first car he bought for HIMSELF that he loved. In 2002 gas prices and the environment weren't big issues to anyone but us true treehuggers (he fooled me for years, what can I say?). He sure enjoys driving an automatic again, but he just isn't a treehugger in his soul like me. But he sure does love to save lots of money NOW with MY good old Prius.

POINT 4 - I almost forgot cold weather driving on short trips (before the engine warms up) bring the mpgs on the Prius way down. Going to my gym in the winter 5 min. away used to be a killer - so if I mostly drove 5 min trips between fillups, it was hard (below 44 degrees F) to get better than 37mpgs in the winter. Still not too bad, but not great for a Prius. Now, with my MS I don't go to the gym, I get exercise in my lifestyle day to day for free AND I don't waste the gas driving to the gym. Again it's a win/win situation.

MJO - okay, I am done. Peace. This whole thing just hit us treehuggers in the gut, because as it turns out, we really can't help it. It is truly in our hearts and souls to be treehuggers. It isn't a personal choice for us anymore - it is just simply who we are. We feel safe here (even though people can be very negative and judgemental anywhere) we just got the wind knocked out of us a little. So people can make fun of us, call us fringe lunatics (poor Rachel Ray - ANOTHER reason not to waste those coffee cups from Dunkin Donuts), we just want to be the best people we can be, a little better than yesterday. This wasn't personal against you, but it just reminds us all that we all have so far still to go, even here. When we think of all the people out there who are TOTALLY unaware, it's more than just a little daunting.

But YES, WE CAN GET THIS DONE!! OKAY!

Truly, truly Peace to you and your family.

How Green® of you. Heck it is no different the Sierra Club gloating about the lastest "hybrid SUVs" and how great they are. Really the only solution is to re-green and re-wild and go back to the way we used to be humans and nature and animals living in harmony, and it will take small steps but inventing new technology that is Green® is not really going to help but looking to the past will!

[with the oil running out, I certainly think you're right - that's where we are headed mjo]

Hi new here. I'm really trying hard to understand your reasoning but I guess I never will since it's your own personal thought process.
As for myself, I owned a Honda Pilot and it got to the point where I was embarrassed to drive it. I traded it in for a used Prius. I live in a rural area in the northeast and if anyone needs four wheel or all wheel drive it's me. But I chose the Prius anyway, and we've been making it fine. I just change to snow tires in the Winter. Whenever I need to haul something big I rent a truck from Home Depot. I have three kids and they fit fine in the back seat. My oldest is nine years old but has the height of a 12 year old. My husband made the comment that it would be uncomfortable and how we may need the space and I just said, you know what, we're just kickin' it old school.
Caroline

I know it's been awhile on this, but I just wanted to add in my story. My husband and I are expecting a child and will need to buy a new car (the ones we have now are both 10 year old 2 doors). We also have two medium/large dogs who can take up a fair bit of space when traveling. Our ideal car would be a station wagon, and I have looked at *every* wagon on the market. In general they all get around the same mileage as the CR-V, with some exceptions (Fit, Matrix) which have far less cargo space. The CR-V also gets excellent safety and emissions ratings. Basically, crossover SUV's *are* station wagons - at least in the US where there are very few true wagons on the market. I find it ironic that people would probably have found the purchase of a Subaru wagon less offensive, when the CR-V does just as well (if not better, depending on model) on gas, and has the same safety and reliability ratings. My point is you need to judge a car based on it specs, not whether or not it looks like a dreaded SUV. Personally I find it hard to consider anything with 4 cylinders a typical SUV. Also, the hybrid SUV's currently on the market do not get all that great of mileage, and are not considered to be very reliable.
If anything MJO should be applauded on his incredibly low annual mileage, not shunned for buying a car that moderately resembles a gas guzzler in appearance alone. I think that many people who posted negatively have not really researched what is on the market in the US these days - until we get more options the CR-V is about as good as he was going to do.

hey this is great a whole bunch of people criticizing one guy for doing what he felt was right. Fabulous.
You do not judge a man or his actions unless you have been in his situation.

Everybody can go on and on about green this and green that, but when it comes down to the hard actual decision making, reality hits. sure he may need to cart a dishwasher once or twice in maybe a decade. Its and example. not factor in te fact that cyclists are having a a bad baad time on the roads. y?? road rage, rash driving and don't give a flying f**k attitude.

lay off him will ya!

I think it's a very bad idea to go for something that feels safer when you know it isn't. Same with cycle helmets.

Because you have this thing that *feels* safer (helmet, or car height) you take more risks without realising it and ultimately you are less safe.

It does indeed come under the do as I say not as I do, but I think that kind of self-righteous preaching has done more to alienate people from the climate movement than attract them. We should not be depoliticising the issue and pretending that virtuous individual action will help keep the climate stable.

Seriously...

You haven't fired this guy yet?

* EPA-estimated mpg 20/27/23 (city/highway/combined 2WD) and 20/26/22 (city/highway/combined 4WD).

No, we're a site that pretends to care about the environment because it's hip, trendy and we can sound impressive while we're at cocktail parties with other Yuppies about how WE'RE SAVING the world.

Also, we're here to make money, don't expect us to make personal sacrifices in our lives, WE CARE about the environment - didn't you read all our self-righteous articles about how to save the planet?

How Treehugger jumped the shark...

Forgive me if this has already been said - I didn't read through all the comments, but I found this quite depressing. The justifications for getting the SUV were so flimsy.

Leaving aside the explanation for why to get any new car, the decision to get the SUV came down to two factors, at least as the faux interview presents it:

1) Having enough space to transport a dishwasher and the extended family when they come to visit.
2) The perception of safety.

Regarding the space issue, as some of the comments I did read pointed out, you don't often transport dishwashers, or indeed anything else that you couldn't fit into a Prius. In a response to one comment, the author talks about needing to transport groceries and so on. As someone who does all the shopping - groceries, and lumber - for a family of three in a car SMALLER than a Prius, I can state with certainty that it is not a problem. When we need to move something bigger, we get a van or pickup from a car share company, rental agency or a friend. The same when extended family comes to town. This is a much more sensible approach to meeting the occasional need for a bigger vehicle than driving the bigger vehicle all the time just because of those occasional occasions.

As for the safety issue, as the author points out, it was just a perception thing. And that perception thing has a dark side. Studies have shown that SUV drivers tend to be more risky in their driving because of that perception. And any safety advantage for the passengers INSIDE the SUV is offset by the greater risk to people outside the SUV. Other studies have looked at the higher rates of accidents involving pedestrians, and the more serious injuries to people in cars that are involved in accidents with SUVs.

Instead of this faux interview, where the author doesn't really push himself on anything, it might have been nice to see a real interview with someone who might have challenged the author on his decision. (Any interviewer would have probed that perception of safety thing - did the author actually research the safety issue, or just go with his feelings?)