Under Water City Proposed for Amsterdam
by Lloyd Alter, Toronto on 02.15.08
It seems a bit counter-intuitive; we are used to seeing Dutch floating projects, not buried ones. Architect Moshé Zwarts says ""There has always been a lack of space in the city, so what we are doing is building a city under the city by using a new construction technique, which will not interfere with street traffic."- by draining and then building under the canals.
And what does he propose filling it with? Parking, shopping and "leisure".
The engineers say it is doable. “It is both feasible and sustainable, creating a city beneath the city is not futuristic, it is a necessity in this day and age.” Zwarts says the geology is great for this. "Amsterdam sits on a 30-metre layer of waterproof clay which will be used together with concrete and sand to make new walls. Once we have resealed the canal floor, we will be able to carry on working underneath while pouring water back into the canals. It's an easy technique and it doesn't create issues with drilling noises on the streets."
In some ways the notion is quite clever; one can work under the canals without seriously disrupting life on the land. But we might question whether one should be digging up Amsterdam for parking and shopping, and they might have added public transit and bike lanes to keep us happy. Michael Hammond of World Architecture News has his doubts too:
"This scheme and its underlying drivers, fly in the face of every responsible principle of sustainability and current trends. The architects also claim that the proposal is CO2 neutral but when questioned by WAN, Professor Zwarts acknowledged that his calculations omitted the carbon generated by construction, which in a mammoth scheme like would take many decades to recoup, if ever.....That this project is technically achievable is not in doubt, but that does not justify its flawed concept." ::World Architecture News
i can't help it, a big part of me still thinks this is very cool. i know it's at least in part because of all the under-ground/under-water cities i've read about in sci-fi novels, but whatever!
i'm sure there HAS to be a way to make construction smarter, too. also, 'parking' isn't a sector that should be included - except on a very small, non-public scale. People utilyzing this under-city, should have to walk, bike, or use well-designed, well-integrated public transport!
If it takes the parking off the surface, that would open up the streets to a lot more of those bike lanes you want.
I think air quality would be a big issue though - I wouldn't exactly want my "leisure" space shared with the heavy exhaust fumes one often finds in underground parking garages.
I lived in China for a year in the city of Dalian. whilst i was there i saw many projects where ground was dug out and filled with shopping and leisure space. these spaces where dug out under high rise buildings!
it was very cool if not very scary because of the type of labor china builds with but very doable.
this idea seems like a really good one, i know many people here will criticize it for being unsustainable but sometimes we have to do things that are not sustainable in order to create a place where sustainable things and eco environments can be built.
by moving these spaces underground you all space that is currently to retail space to be taken for new homes without having to go onto land which can be used for growing trees and the like and losing green space! these retail spaces will be created, i would prefer to see them underground than going across green space!
Despite the odd idea of creating more parking in Amsterdam, this idea seems like it has quite a bit of potential.
Introducing pollution through the cars into an enclosed underground city does not seem like a brilliant idea to me. Also, these designs don't seem to accommodate safety layers in case of a cave-in or something. Maybe this isn't necessary, but it seems to me it should be, right?
Why do I get the feeling that 'leisure' is a code word for h00kers?
It should be noted that the source of this idea is one of the major building contractors in the Netherlands.
What about using the space under the canals for transport system and roads... leaving all that lovely top side area for walkers and cyclists!!! beneath the planet of the apes any one?
Great idea...but, as other writer mentioned - what about polluton from cars? Energy from bringing people up/down with escalators/elevators? Clean air down to people....leaks....The huge cost of digging down. It is a do-able project - but is it economically feasible ....
Seems to be easier to just builder higher - but that may of course have its problems of it own.
I love the idea: make the whole thing a parking garage. Now invite owners of gas-guzzlers to park down there. When it's full, seal it up! Bury those things in a modern tomb!
The downside of underground development is condensation and moisture not being vented. Water and ice would provide an insulator but in extreme temperature periods the moisture levels/humidity might be uncomfortable. Atlanta has an underground mall that is very pleasant, if dark. Of course, you have the expense of lighting and ventilation.
Only a few years before we see Bioshock for real.
It sounds like a great idea to me, other than the whole idea of bringing cars in. There is a good reason they don't build roads and parking inside the mall. Its deadly.
I would think that if they are going to be doing the digging anyway, they should build a subway.
Whoever mentioned the energy needed for elevators/escolators to bring people to the surface, thats no bigger a problem than in your normal city high rise, not a huge issue.
I don't see the problem with adding parking. I think the ideal would be to close the city center to cars but to ring it with free underground parking.
As for underground shopping and sports complexes, those are really things I prefer to do above ground. Malls are annoying enough wihtout being underground.
This is insane, the Netherlands has a massive problem with its growing Muslim community. With limited space, perhaps a better idea would be to send all those people who have come to the country yet failed to integrate back to there own countries.
Apparently human civilization has learned nothing from Bioshock
interesting!!!
We all know the Dutch are known for there engineering abilities, primarily the canals, but honestly I think this is going a bit to far. Building underground is not only extremely expensive with a myriad of possible ‘mishappenings’, being underground can be displeasing.
Think of the last time you went into a cavern or rode the subway. Maybe it's just me but I do know enjoy the feeling of being under multiple tons of earth, especially if its man made. I'm not saying that they could not pull it off, but it just seems that there are to many problems for what you could get out of the space. Not to mention the cost of excavation.
Also about being underground, I do not enjoy not being able to see the sun. I know in most modern shopping malls there are no windows, but most that I've been to have atriums where you can look outside.
I do agree with Jim however that if the space was used primarily for parking that would open up space for walking and bicycling in the ever beautiful city of Amsterdam
if only we can afford to have something like this in the urban areas of maldives ...
Does anyone remember the story of Boston's "Big Dig"? Underground tunneling merely move traffic highways under the surface. It was multiple times over budget. Ended up costing $1Billion ++. Then a year or two ago the roof fell in and killed a motorist.
Dutch planners need to look at the case studies before pronouncing this 'doable'. It's probably more of a curse than a blessing.
Would you kindly create a gene science section below the parking lot?
for the future's elite subcultures able to afford moving to more costly and/or secure sub-aquatic or subterranean cities, such sub-cities may allow them the luxury of saving civilization in an era of climate crises and the attendant chaos that may well ensue on the earth's surfaces
terrorists like bringing down buildings, but with this being under the city, they'll just be able to bring down the city instead. Good way of getting rid of those red light districts that the mayor was talking about.
this isn't anything new, if anyone has ever been to Seoul Korea, you'll know that they have a huge network of underground shops, along with underground transportation
Someone needs to retext that graphic as follows.
Chances of:
Death>Sports
Dying>getting underground hookers (leisure)
Superunderwater tragedy>Supermarket
Mass car and people grave>Parking
Wet data/obituaries/memorial>data data data!
then add an extra level that says "Pissed off morlocks" at the bottom. lol.
As a reaction to Mike:
in the Netherlands we have a big problem with racists. If they would leave the country the good-willing people would have more space.
As said before: this is not a plan of the Dutch government. This is a plan of a big construction company that tries to create a job for itself.
Everyone needs to realize that the creators of this project have clean, green vehicles in mind, not the old gas guzzlers. Also, the energy needed to furnish lighting could be supplied by wave energy. We shouldn't discount the fact that Amsterdam in the Netherlands sits right by an ocean in a perfect place for wave and tide energy projects. Ok, It's a bit futuristic, but that's what we need if our kids are going to inherit a planet that's not going to be unnecessarily toxic.
I think it could be a cool and green project. Just think of the night life and after hours activities that could happen there. What a great place for a night out.
Mike A
Coos Bay, Oregon
it will be brilliant if they get it right
tucx
age 12
My question is why Amsterdam would want to build more space for cars? Lets not be counterproductive here. Stay strong with the bike and mass transit program. Underground shopping space is fine, but loose the parking space. If anything, add under gound bike lanes or mass transit.
I believe this is the wave of the future. We are distroying the world with our polution and crap.. Soon it will be to hot to live on the surfice. we need to look to the future to see whats in it for our grandchildren. If we could come up with a way to take the co2 lvls and transform them to oxygen like a greenary under water plants takeing in carbon and giving us oxygen.. its not as difficult as one might think just very expensive.
the pictures are cool
the pictures are cool