Thanks, editors, for the reality checks on articles. Keep it up!

Actually, I wrote "Ed" but it was I who wrote the editorial comment. Thanks for noticing.

I have read a lot about the electric cars and my drive to do what is impossible makes me wonder if there is an electric car with generators mounted in the wheel spindles which will charge the battery while you drive.

Not a novel idea I know. I had such a system on my old Schwinn bicycle when I was a child all those many years ago.

However, the ability to actually use the energy generated by the tire rotation and return it to the battery could, if not keep the battery charged, then at least increase the travel abilities for each charge.

Jim Windwalker,
You can't get more energy out of a generator than the energy the electric motor uses to spin it! That would be a perpetual motion machine, thesecond law of thermodynamics says this can't work.

You definitely want a regenerative braking system that recovers kinetic energy to recharge the battery when you slow the car, but using the motor to recharge the battery only makes sense if the motor power comes from a different source (the gasoline engine in a hybrid, or your legs pedaling the bike).

Companies have considered putting a combined generator+motor at each wheel, but that's four times the expense and the wheel is a hostile environment, so hybrid cars tend to have a central engine and generator and conventional driveshafts.

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Regards
Choi

I was in London last week and I saw a couple of those parked - and wondered what the hell they were! - I'm from Sydney!

This site is great. I am interested to know more about environment friendly products.

The second law of thermodynamics may say it can not work, but the law of gravity also says that planes can't fly either.

Human nature says defying the laws of science are as simple as imagination and determination.

And of course it is indeed simple to get more energy out than expended. A long pole with a wedge moving a huge object is a very simple example.

I suppose in part it depends on how one looks at it.

As an industrial electrician I have on more than one ocassion used a gear and pully system to generate energy which was greater than the output voltage.

A simple example is a DC generator used to power an AC converter which in turn will supply as many DC chargers as amperage will allow. Amperage can be increased by a simple transformer method.

I know nothing at all about thermodynamics, but I know a lot about electricity.

With all due respect Jim, it is not possible to get more energy out of a system than put in. The law of conservation of energy says energy can neither be created nor destroyed. The amount of energy in a system (such as the energy being expended by a vehicle's wheel to turn a generator)is related to mass and velocity. Velocity of course is distance per unit of time.

The example you gave of the wedge and lever does conserve energy...it makes possible the moving of a heavier weight, but slower. Think of riding a bicycle--if you shift to a lower gear, the pedaling gets easier (less energy expended) but at a cost of velocity. To make the bicycle move at the same speed it was in the higher gear, you must pedal faster, exerting the same energy you would have used in the higher gear.

To use a battery to turn a motor which then turns a generator to put power back in the battery is a losing proposition. Most of the energy will be used to move the vehicle; only a fraction of the energy will be used to turn the generator. And even in a perfect world, the generator will only be able to replace the energy being applied to turn it, the energy used to move the vehicle will be dissipated as heat in the tires. And we don't live in a perfect world...even if the generator was the only thing being driven (vehicle not moving) some energy will be dissipated in the generator as heat in the bearings, etc...it won't all be returned to the battery.

Finally, the law of gravity does not say planes cannot fly, it merely describes a given force that must be applied in an opposite direction to overcome gravity's effects. In this case gravity pulls down, air pressure pulls up as a vacuum is created over the wings by the flow of air over the wings

who Cares - Great Car. Great Idea.

It's gonna be hard, but I hope those cars get to Chile...soon! Santiago is so polluted, and fuel is expensive, I know it would be a great bussisness to bring them here...and of course great to the enviroment.
This blog is incredible, I just discovered it and now I read it everyday. Thanks a lot

Watched a very interesting review on the G Wiz electric car last night. Tim Lovejoy from Channel 5’s Fifth Gear took to the streets of London to see if the £7,000 G Wiz was a practical enough vehicle. He found it wasn’t much use for taking the kids to school as it was a little on the small side for the children in the back but was adequate enough to get him self and his golf clubs in, so not too bad I suppose.

It is reckoned that the £7,000 price tag for the car will pay for its self within 1 year due to the car being exempt from the congestion charge, road tax, and can be parked for free in central London. The top speed of the car is just 40 mph and can travel for 40 miles on a single charge. In my eyes this is perfected for anyone living in the central of London.

This type of technology should be must be a concern of everyone. It is much cleaner and does considerable less damage to the environment Oil prices rose above $59 a barrel today 13/10/06 and it is predicted that it could rise as much as $100 per barrel.

The only disadvantage of owning an electric car is that they are usually quite slow; they cannot travel far due to the recharging aspect. Maybe we will see electric charging points in garages instead of fuel pumps. Even so I do think that people should be considering going all-electric in the future.

Clean the air? It is possible. Clean water? It is possible too.
Clean energy? It is possible as well.
My idea is very difficult for understanding. It is not difficult for engineer - mechanic, who knows very good the Pascal's law and even-arm lever.
Please open GOOgle and find metozor and next :
index of metozor.
Overthere is all about idea of main .
example : http://www.nets.pl/~metozor/for_greenpeace.html or
http://www.nets.pl/~metozor/energy_for_everybody.h...
http://www.nets.pl/~metozor/prolog_for_metoz.html
Email this article to a friend.

Hi evry1,
Im an Indian,currently doin Automobile engineerin in Germany. I hv a strong belief tht Electric cars r da future. BUt somehow all the big companies r shyin away from them. N da reason is tht many oil companies hv holdings in these companies.
The age old argument ,tht evn some of our profs give is tht 'though electric cars seem2b environment friendly , but the more electric cars v have ,da more electricity vl hv2generate i.e burn more coal again.So its one n da same thing' . Somehw i cant digest this thought. wud like2knw ur opinions on it.
regards,
gaurav

Thanks Windwalker for talking some sense. I have grave concerns about the industrial electrics that Mr. P Roshin Kumar Narayan is involved in based on his limited knowledge of the most fundamental electrical and physical concepts. The best you can hope for is a lossless system - energy can't be created. Any losses as Windwalker describe in friction, tyre heat, noise, etc. reduce the energy available to drive the car and/or drive a generator in the wheel - which should only be used when the motor is not driving the wheels i.e. under deceleration, otherwise you just increase the energy output requirements from the motor.

In the examples Mr. P gives he confuses energy and power and energy and force. The lever increases the force applied to the object levered but energy is conserved apart from very small losses. Energy is not magnified or increased. With regard to using a generator to power a number of chargers - you split the available energy across the chargers and use some of the available energy in losses in the generator/convertor/chargers.

otherwise a good blog about a neat product and a good application to make our cities better places to live, drive and work.

they should add pedals although pedalling may not add much its not only green its good for you.

I'm wondering the same thing as the Indian automobile engineer working in Germany... what would be some of the negative consequences to the environment of integrating electric vehicles on a large scale in places like New England or U.S. cities? Are there any cons that would outweigh the benefits?

Gasoline would not be used... but if the electricity being used comes from power plants after going through a bunch of conversions (and in New England it predominantly comes from coal-fired power plants, other places from nuclear, oil, natural gas, hydro, etc... and the second law of thermodynamics means a loss of energy through the various transfers from mining to energy product), how much total net energy could we lose/gain in the long run, and how much greenhouse gasses emissions and air pollution would be prevented? I don't know a whole lot in this area, but it'd be nice to hear about it on a larger scale. Would there be a risk that increased demand of electricity could lead to other problems in electricity generation and increased exploitation of other resources? (Athough, I've heard that it's extremely cheap, available, realistic, and even ideal if charged during non-peak hours.)

I support electric cars in cities, (& I think hybrids are glamorous and a great environmentally friendly idea)... but I have not heard of any major environmental cons that may result from an increase demand of electric energy... are there? Are there any arguments against electric vehicles because of the possibility of increased coal/other energy/net energy/pollution increase? Or would the increased efficiency of power plants, the power grids, alternative energy, optional off-peak recharging, and advancement of technology mean there are no major risks to worry about when it comes to electric vehicles?

Just a few questions!

Cant an electric vehicle run with a small DC generator which gives power equivalent to the existing Battery output? Wont it be efficient than the current gasoline engine?

Orlowski/Anonymous: It's a case of baby-steps: Reduce the numbers of gasoline engines first, change the public's vehicle-mindset, then reduce power station emissions by introducing greener technologies into electricity production.One must follow the other. Offset the increased demand for electricity from more EV's by reducing power consumption in the home, e.g. micro-wind turbines, solar roof panels etc.. The problem's too big to try and sweep the boards clean. Elizabeth: they already do. The regenerative braking system uses vehicle momentum to drive a generator charging the batteries, as oppposed to dissipating the inertia as heat & friction through the brakes.

It's great to read that hundreds of electric cars running around in UK, to fight global warming/climate change.

However, I'm guessing that the good e-car folks in will find the $$$$$ cost of batteries to be un-affordable, and simply abandon EV's, as they have here, even in BC, Canada, where (in my estimation) 80% of electric cars are idle and unlicensed (with less than 40 registered in the whole province.)

Therefore, if and when they discover that can't afford the cost of replacement batteries, perhaps the folks in London will come back to this question and look at my Vancouver-made zero-cost battery electric pickup truck video URL/link, of the Global TV newscast, which I just uploaded to Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueq-gbvcf...
I'm offering the methods of using discarded batteries to power EV's.

Rob Matthies
Vancouver, Canada

How many electric cars are now running in London because of the congestion tax? Is it really as high as 14,000 which is what "The Economist" article stated?

Did you know that Vancouver, Canada has the world's first licensed electric pickup truck that has a "zero-cost" battery -- runs entirely on discarded batteries that considered dead or unusable. There are *three* battery breakthroughs in this electric pickup truck, as well as a half-dozen workarounds/fixes to the (usual) weak components found on electric cars.

Here's what the Global TV evening newscast aired, from a Youtube download:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEq-GbVcFTA

Also, check out the EV Album entry for this electric pickup truck, with a Google search for EVALBUM FREEB or WORLD'S FIRST REVIVED BATTERY PICKUP DIARY.

Why bother to revive dead batteries for the electric car? In British Columbia, Canada, 80% of 4-wheeled electric cars are sitting unused because they are TOO EXPENSIVE to run, costing 2X-10X more than gasoline. One member of the Vancouver Electric Vehicle Association got less than 900 kilometers from his EV battery pack before it needed replacement, at some $1,700 cost. Therefore, it's quite possible that Londoners will be abandoning their electric Reva G-Wiz, Maranello-4, Mega City, Th!nk, cars, too. The "FreeB" in Vancouver runs off cost-free discarded batteries. Would London electric car or electric scooter or electric bike owners like this, too?

Please reply by email to:
Rob Matthies
Vancouver, BC, Canada
robert04mat@yahoo.com
or phone Canada:
(604) 739-7717 [with Jajah, call us free, we're on Jajah, too]

These cars are brilliant fun to drive, I had the Eureka moment in India with my partner and we decided to distribute them in Ireland by forming www.greenaer.ie.

Because we do not benefit from the incentives that they have in London the motivation for buying the car is still very environmental and the first few buyers (a dozen ) would get on like a house on fire , electric cars are really restoring a sense of community and friendliness in the cities and I really hope that more and more people will make the switch .

Clearly who needs a big SUV in town ?

We have just released a few videos on youtube that you might want to have a look at ( they are really funny I promise)

Don t hesitate to write me an email if you did nt like them !
STEVE UNCOVERS THE WILD REVA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrfC8CQAPLs&feature=related

SMALL CAR BIG SOUL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDnCpc-isXk&feature=related

HOLY COW
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnlJtTdKKKQ

Enjoy everyone!

olivier@greenaer.ie

I think these electric cars are great. I would buy one even although you have top journey of about 300 miles.