A very interesting article. However, I'd like to interject on the horsepower issue...

Honestly, I don't think it's a question of auto manufacturers' seriousness about greening the fleet as it is about making money. Cars with more horsepower sell big, everybody wants to be the first kid on the block with 200, 250, 300, 350+ horsepower underneath the hood, even when you don't need it.

I got a lot of flack when I bought my '02 Prius (98 combined HP), even from people who I considered to be intelligent, well-thought individuals. There's a social stigma against low-HP vehicles these days, I don't know if they're uncool, or just perceived as unfit for highway travel (I got that one a lot, "How do you keep up with highway traffic with that little horsepower?").

So, yeah, while the automakers may not be chomping at the bit to go all green, I think the real problem is the national mentality that more horsepower = better vehicle.

Your comment and my post together pose the classic "chicken or egg" dilemma. For the future, it is impossible to answer what is the primary causative factor (consumers or producers) until either a Western car maker steps up with an on-lot choice that's simple and green, or failing that, a Chinese car maker delivers a post-modern YUGO version. That would provoke an onslaught of affordable green designs, just as happened in the late 1970's and early 80's with the VW Beetle and Honda Civic.

My key point is that mo metric has validity until the choices are universally available, and this applies even to the hybrids which are not at all acecssible. THis refers back to the marketing approach where a car's appearance is its own advertisement.

I love automobiles, and I mean ecstatically so. To that end, it saddens me when the eco-elites advocate efficient yet stodgy, plodding models that are the antithesis to car-culture. Performance and style are an integral part of many car-owner's driving experience. There is hope in efforts by Mercedes-Benz in their E320 CDI, an ultra-high performance diesel (201 HP V6, 0-60mph in 6.8 seconds) while STILL getting 27mpg/city, 37/highway. Combine an electric hybrid system and that figure could potentially double. Not to mention, an owner could potentially burn biodiesel made from waste vegetable oils and eco-effective cellulosic ethanol. This is an example of a wonderfully carbon-neutral automobile (manufacturing inputs aside), unlike Honda's natural gas option. It would still require a fossil fuel that, although it is cleaner burning, is becoming more costly and desireable, and coming from other places. We use tremendous amounts of natural gas for electricity production, so little should be diverted for transport.

Al -

I have no idea where you live, but I can tell you that here (SIlver Spring, MD (A suburb of Washington DC)) if I could get a Prius I would, and end up with the applause (rather than derision) of my peers. They would applaud that choice even as I traded in an Audi A4 3.0 (yes, thus six cylinders) to do so.

I don't only because of the waiting lists that one must get on; 8 months to get a car? I can't be without one for that long, sadly. (even as I live a block away from a subway (Metro) stop)

-RS

I too love cars. But anything by Mercedes is far far above my price range. Therefore I do not consider myself elite, just cheap. Prius is at the top end of affordability for me. And I judge for many others as well. Thus began my plea.

Rahul,

When I bought the car in late '02, it was derision / laughter for my stupid choice.

When hybrids got popular in '04, I got a lot of apologies / compliments for my forward-thinking.

People's attitudes change with the times, but Emil's post demonstrates that there are people to whom performance is more important that gas milage, and I would postulate that a majority of auto owners feel that to some degree or another.

I see your point, John. It really comes down to a question of who's going to make the first move, and what it should be. My thoughts are that car companies need to introduce hybrid powertrains across their entire line of vehicles (like Toyota is in the process of) and let consumers choose for themselves, not based on gas mileage, but on other factors as well.

As I type this, I am about to meet my father at Lexus, he's picking up his RX400h today (#1 on the waiting list for 18 months). Yes, it's expensive. Yes, it's a luxury car. And, yes, it has a massive amount of horsepower under the hood.

I just bought a '05 Toyota Prius when I probably could have done better to drive my paid off '98 Neon for another year and save the money. But, I gotta tell you I feel like I am in a space machine. I hate my job.... but this car picks me up just to drive it. California has an excess of cars on the lots in LA, so, if anyone would rather get one than wait 8 months- take a vacation and drive it back cross country!

When people play the speed=performance card with me, I counter by comparing my driving needs to that of a marathon runner, not a sprinter. Distance is my primary performance metric, not acceleration.

The idea I'm toying with now is trading in the old '99 Civic Hatchback and investing in a GreenSpeed trike with BionX electric assist for my daily commute (and health). We have the baby car-seat in the HCHybrid, so my wife uses that during the day for all the errands and such.

I say pimp the rides, but you can pimp them for better mileage. Hey the carbon fiber hoods and certain body kits save weight and reduce drag thus improving efficiency.

Same with changing the cheap paper air cleaner and replacing it with one that flows better.

Or getting better plugs that ignite more of the fuel.

How about filling the tires with nitrogen which is an inert gas and doesn’t change pressure with a temperature change. It also reduces oxidation on the tires themselves.

Hey there are ways to pimp to make the car more efficient.

Also people buy cars not only for transportation but also out of emotion and part of that emotion is style. A lot of the new “bling” cars out there are all show and no go. But they look good.

What we need are good-looking cars that also are environmentally cool. Good examples are the new Lexus Vehicles. They have style and environment technology.

Nothing wrong with making environmentalism more chic

Get a used 97-03 VW TDI, fill it with biodiesel. An echo getting 35mpg is a nice improvement over the typical sedan, but you're just sucking a little less off big oil's teat. A used diesel probably still has 300k miles of life left in it, will cost a bundle less, diesel is everywhere, biodiesel is in most cities and can be made in your garage. Renewable, Efficient, Long Lasting, High Torque, Locally Produced, Biodiesel.

>diesel

What about the particulate matter in Diesel? Is anyone an expert on diesel's impact on air quality, as well as the different flavors?

http://www.catf.us/projects/diesel/

I ahd a discussion recently with someone who claimed all diesel was worse from a polution perspective than gasoline. I have had trouble finding a direct comparison of exhausts, and the different fuel flavors, engines, emisions management only complicate things

I'll respond in generalities as "replies" do not lend themselves to analytical detail. Diesel emitted particles are health threatening because of a unique aspect of human physiology. The particle size (I think it's about 4 micron average but don't quote me) is diffcult for our lungs to expell, once inhaled, aand therefore expose the alveoli continuously to condensed polyaromatic hydrocarbons, that are irritating (coughs/allergy/ashma) and potentially cancer promoting (as opposed to causing. Pollens, on the other hand are easily expelled, as are other larger particles.

Design as you will, the best made diesel engines still emit these particles, and so that is why EPA has proposed new engines by 2007 have particulate filters to remove them. Because only as few percent of all US autos are diesel, its not much of a problem for a transition. Trucks and buses are an issue however. A good diesel engine lasts three times as long as a gasoline engine (good in terms of reducing the amount of stuff consume per mile of transport), so retrofitting the oldies with the particulate filters is currently a hot political topic (self imposed Duh!).

Bottom line is that any diesel engine regardless of what fuel it burns, emits hasardous particles; but, the serious exposure to us humans is from commercial, not domestic vehicle emissions. As the risk is form cumulative exposure, not from your own car in or any other one vehicle, you should not feel guilty about driving a diesel car.

Conversely, you should be proud to own a diesel car as your ownership is growing a market that will in just a few years offer more widespreadd efficiency to average people while eliminating a hazardous exposure. As for lcimate change, mpg for a diesel vehile is in general better than any gas engine powered one so don't sweat that either.

What you should worry about is reactionary politics demonizing the EPA to the point where the standards is stopped before it goes into force or made ineffective by budget cuts.

Hope that helps.

i have acar mazda capella 75 ,i want join to pimp my ride,but ,,,why???

thanks

roy

Def. agree about making a car greener, leaner & meaner. Many things can make a car faster & more efficient. http://www.fueleconomy.gov/
Nissan recently struck a deal /w Toyota to get their hybrid tech. http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/futuremodel.aspx?familyid=1115&pictureid=&usage=Image&src=future
Also, the Civic body is exactly the same /w hybrid & gas only. So, you know there's a lot of "Pimping" 1 can do. http://www.hondacars.com/models/model_overview.asp?ModelName=Civic+Hybrid
Large lightweight new Ford Sedan - "Prodigy" - 70mpg! http://media.ford.com/newsroom/release_display_new.cfm?release=3481

i think pimp my ride is class i wach it all the time i would love to expeariance makin some ones car look mint i think xibit is cool as and it would be a dream come true to meet him and the crew i love the hole crew xxxx

"I think the real problem is the national mentality that more horsepower = better vehicle."

Treehuggers can drive hybrid mopeds if they so choose. As for me, I've never bought a vehicle that I didn't find at some point to need MORE HORSEPOWER AND TORQUE to extract me from some dangerous situation or to tow a heavy load up a steep grade.

That's what makes a market economy great: Freedom of Choice. I can choose to spend my money on high-performance vehicles (e.g. a track-ready 1100-horsepower twin-turbo Viper, Ford GT, F-350 PowerStroke crew cab truck) while you can choose to save with a three-cylinder hybrid microcar.

Furthermore, such choice is fundamental to human happiness. Life is too short to waste it tooling around in a 25 horsepower lawn-tractor-of-a-car, quaking about imaginary environmental impacts. It's a basic human freedom to be able to elect to build or purchase a vehicle which can accelerate 0-60 in less than four seconds or with whatever performance characteristics I can afford and desire. Such rights ought to only be limited by market forces.