The Vectrix Super Fast Electric Scooter

The ‘no emissions’ claim is slightly misleading. There are emissions of course, it’s just that they’re not local to the scooter – they’re at the power station.

For us in Quebec, no emissions means no emissions!
We are using hydro electricity! (for the most part... >80%).
It's just the beginning! We will soon develop new source of clean energy.

The "no emissions" claim is slightly misleading? The scooter does not pollute. How is that misleading? It, the scooter, produces no toxic fumes. If you want to make the statement that the scooter is NOT zero emissions because of where the energy comes from, then, in fact, every manufactured object "produces" emissions. Gimme a break. It's like saying "low-fat" milk is not really "low-fat" since the milk originally had more fat in it than when it reached the shelf.

Are there any alternatives to this already?

I thoguht there would already be something like this?

In answer to one of the previous posts. Yes, there is something like this already. It is at:

http://www.qjpowersports.com/models/escooter.htm

look at the ECO-150. I've ridden it at it will go over 40 mph, with a good 30-40 mile range (depending on terrain, weight, temp, ect - like for any EV). This is a sweeet little scooter, it took about a block for me to get over 40 and was absolutely quite!! Definitely worth checking out!

jerry, i wouldn't be so confident. martin's point is valid. you can either pour fossil fuels into a vehicle on the spot or else burn the fossil fuels off-site to power it. either way the fuels are burned and the emissions are released unless the electricity is coming from a renewable source (which as gerry pointed out is entirely possible, though uncommon in US). the scooter doesn't generate it's own power so where do you think the electricity comes from to recharge it? it's nothing more than displacing the emissions from the point of use to the power plant. the claim of zero emmissions is misleading because in most cases, the emmissions will not be zero.

On the info request page (the one that is linked to), the text says the scooter will be available in the US. It says, "Vectrix scooters will be available in major cities in Europe and the United States in 2005."

The Vectrix produces ZERO emissions. Where the electrity comes from is a TOTALLY different story. But, regardless, the electricity at the end of that energy cycle via the Vectrix, still produces ZERO emissions. This method of transportation, and others like it, reduces the harmful end-effects which have been normally associated with I.C.E.-powered vehicles for almost 100 hundred years. I can live with the ambiguity of what "zero emissions" can mean. And I can most certainly live without the noise and air-pollution of a conventional car, truck, motorcycle, or scooter. I am most grateful that more products like this are becoming not only more available but also competitive at the performance level. Because unfortunately, it seems most consumers are not as willing to choose a "green" option if the product cannot, at the very least, match what they are already accustomed to, real or imagined. I do hope in my lifetime, that all vehicles are true "zero emissions" vehicles. We have that capability.

yes, jerry, technically the vectrix does not emit. but your logic is out-of-sight-out-of-mind. it is not a different story at all, it is a continuous chain of events. to propel the vectrix you need a given amount of energy, whether that is produced on-the-go or in the power plant is what changes. you still need the power and in order to produce that power you will still be generating emissions. do you have data that shows that the net impact of the electric vehicle charged by the US electric grid is actually less damaging than an internal combustion engine? i don't know.

i too want a green solution and EVs do step in that direction as it is likely that the majority of green energy will be distributed via our power grid but to claim that this solution is inherently greener is to not fully realize your environmental footprint. i don't like to derail any environmentally progressive product either, but if you want to claim ZERO emissions, then i would hope that you can take into account the entire chain instead of just the part you want to see.

consider a company that employs sweatshop labor in southeast asia. by your logic, they are socially responsible on american shores, but in fact, they have simply moved the problem elsewhere.

A green solution would be to add solar panels to your dwelling to produce the needed electricity. Or offset the emissions by donating to a wind or solar power project.
ex: www.nativeenergy.com/windbuilders.html

Here in Washington state most of the energy is hydro power as well (80%) and we are also investing in wind and solar power (even in Seattle!)

hijiki, I live in WA state, US. More of our electricity is renewable than even Quebec. We're over

In almost every US city, you can choose to buy green power for your home. At that point, other than manufacturing/maintenance, you are zero emission. Buy a terrapass to make up for that.

hijiki, I live in WA state, US. More of our electricity is renewable than even Quebec. We're renewable for over 90% of our power usage, although we generate some non-renewable for CA.

In almost every US city, you can choose to buy green power for your home. At that point, other than manufacturing/maintenance, you are zero emission. Buy a terrapass to make up for that.

that's great for washington, but massive hydroelectric resources like washington's don't exist throughout the rest of our nation. i think our national goal for electricity is only 20% renewable by 2020... correct me if i'm wrong, but i do know it's terribly low.

if you want to power your transport as well as your home with PV panels then you must be extremely wealthy. the green power options from the providers where i live are also very expensive and not widely utilized. i don't deny that there are ways to get to zero but it takes dilligence that the mainstream isn't interested in. martin's point while regrettable, is still valid in most situations. it is definitely something to take into consideration (ie. not a 'TOTALLY different story') if you want to truly evaluate your footprint.

hey hijiki...i'm all for alternative energy. as far as energy demands are concerned, there is data on this website (www.commutercars.com) in the "downloads" section which addressess some of the I.C.E. vs. Electrics question. Personally, I'm not even sure if local grid systems could handle the electrical load of supporting an entirely electric transportation system if everyone decided tomorrow to go electric. Which merely brings to light that "every solution to a problem is a new problem". So, hybridizing all transportation such that we aren't entirely dependent on one form of energy is key. A diversified portfolio works for financial investments as it does for transportation. Currently, we are heavily invested in fossil fuel. The blackout in NYC not too long ago should be fairly recent reminder as to some of the negative consequences of grid failure and how it can affect all things that run on gas and electricity. Especially since gas pumps are electric. The beauty of electric vehicles for me are primarily that they can work, and have been proven to work on more than one planet. Fuel cells and ICE's included are entirely dependent on oxygen which is an element currently found on one solitary planet. I think it's great that the U.S. and other nations still continue to explore outer space. Who knows, maybe we'll find a place worth sending a few people too (if they can withstand the space travel). And if we do send people anywhere else, I'm fairly certain an electric vehicle would provide the means to explore their new digs...without harmful emissions. Because you know those Earthlings tend to be a bit messy at times. %^)

jerry - The electrical system couldn't support that.
In Japan, most commuter transport is electric rail. That's key - the US needs to do the same, or our energy consumption will continue to skyrocket.

Oxygen is found on every planet we've seen. I don't know where you're getting that. We even have water on other planets.

hijiki, if you want to move to Seattle, e-mail me.

As someone on the inside who has ridden the first three versions of this bike, I can tell you that this is not like anything on the market. As far as acceleration goes, it is the same as the equivalent gas powered scooter (250cc.) As far as the 'clean' question, you are absolutely right. It is only as clean as the source of it's energy. One thing to consider, though, is the extreme amounts of polution put out by it's 2-cycle brethren. A 300 h.p. Dodge Durango is more efficient than the average gas moped. I'll take the dirty electricity for now. Secondly, the plan with vectrix is to offer a second model with a shoe-box sized fuel-cell, developed by Parker-Hannifin, that, assuming normal use (to and from work, errands), would tricle charge the battery constantly, removing the need to plug it in nearly as often (if ever). Instead, an alchohol source (a pint of antifreeze?) for the fuel cell once a month and your ready to go.

I'm an electical engineer, and have been saving an issue of a trade magazine called 'Design News' that ran a feature on this scooter. This is not your typical electric scooter.

The rear wheel is actually the motor. No belt drive. A single stage planetary gear box(also within the rear wheel) conveys the power to the raod. The Aluminum frame weighs in at 25lbs, after extensive FEA (fintite element analysis). Typical tube steel frames weigh in at 80lbs.

One cheif engineer of a German motorcycle manufacturer said to the Vectrix design team (after dissappearing for 45 minutes on a test drive) "You've built a weapon"

If this this were sold stateside. I'd actually contemplate owning one.

I saw the very first prototype Vectrix run some 6yr ago. These guys have been putting the product and infrastucture together for years. Saw the new unvieling 2 weeks ago. WOW ! This ain't your uncles old Vespa! It's the size of a motorcycle. Big disk brakes. Comfy seat for two. Cool dash. Very upscale body design. They really got the electrics right on with mileage and speed. The Parker/Hannifin liquid fuel cell will be an expensive option, but how cool to use a bottle of windshield fluid to charge up for another 70 miles (while you have lunch) Vectrix has something here. I hope the UsA market will respond. Manufacturing locations in MA and Poland. Belly Up Boys !

according to my research, oxygen is not found on every planet we've seen:

http://www.solarviews.com/eng/homepage.htm

http://www.nmm.ac.uk/server/show/conWebDoc.280

http://www.lonparc.freeserve.co.uk/nineplanets/nineplanets.html

this data alone should lead us to design and implement concepts which preserve this rare element that is essential to our survival.

ugh...sometimes people get on their high horse and just ain't qualified to be up there. Guys, the very idea that this scooter is not really "zero emissions" because it uses electricity that must come from some electrical plant that pollutes is asinine. Puhleeze. With that kind of logic:

-Everyone posting here is polluting because they are using technology, which almost certainly runs on electricity, which must have come from some plant that, either in it's day-to day operations or it's construction, causes/caused a great deal of pollution. Furthermore, the posters here are using a computer/laptop/pda, the manufacture of which would have caused pollution from the HP/Toshiba/Dell plant. These plants that made your computing device not only use that "dirty" electricity (in most cases, at least), they also use plastics, copper, silicon, metal, etc to make your tech device. Those products came from production plants that cause a great deal of pollution on a daily basis.

You could go on and on about emissions issues with this ridiculous logic, but the original point...that this scooter does not produce emissions...is going to be obvious to *most* reasonable people. The device ITSELF does not create emissions from it's powerplant...nuff said.

hehe..that's essentially what i was getting at the beginning of this topic.

by the way, the hamsters powering my computer are definitely not zero emissions.

Martin/Hijiki's points are valid. One doesn't often think about the energy chain as a whole. H/W practically speaking jerry's points as reinforced by VinceDee's brutal logic win the day. The Vectrix seems like a socially responsible product and I think we should encourage the creators by applauding them. Today electric powered, tomorrow combination solar and electricity and so forth. Its funny how it seems some people will go to extreme lengths just to find fault in the works or claims of others. Its this type of mentality which turns off the average person from advocating environmental awareness.

To be perfectly honest, I don't want the average person to advocate environmental awareness. If anyone is going to advocate such awareness, they should be above average and well-informed. If anyone is going to advocate environmental awareness, they should have the ability to go to extreme lengths to find faults in the works or claims of others. Especially if those "others" work for fossil fuel industries. But, if anyone is going to advocate environmental awareness, he/she must also know the art of compromise. Because, as you mention, Martin and Hijiki's points are certainly valid and that the Vectrix as a zero-emission vehicle is misleading, but only to the average person. I am fully aware of the process to create and distribute energy in the U.S. But in that process of educating myself, I have found faults in the system that need a serious overhauling. The first of which would be to reduce our dependency on imported petroleum. America is the number one country in all of the known universe to consume the most petroleum:

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2174rank.html

That also makes us the number one polluters. If one product can, at the very least, reduce the pollution cycle by one step, then that is a huge step forward in helping to end our dependency on fossil fuel. We HAVE to start making alternative means of energy production a priority. All the Vectrix needs is electricity. The renewable methods of energy production (wind, water, solar) are processess that are also found on other planets. If we can fine-tune these methods here on Earth, then we have the means to use these non-polluting methods elsewhere. That's the big picture for me. I want us to live up to our pioneering spirit and to see what else is out there. However, I would much rather have us do that by treading as lightly as possible. And that's a job that should not be left for the average person.

what is the dimension, material og the design

Hey, very spirited thread going on here! I have two questions for everybody. 1) What vehicle would you like to be stuck behind in a traffic jam on a hot, humid, windless day? A Vectrix or a similar sized ICE powered scooter? 2) Has one ever thought how much electricity it takes from well to wheels to produce the gas in your tank that makes even more pollution? Hey, charge the scooter with wind, sun or whatever and call it zero emission...at least you have that option. Let me know when you can produce a gallon of gas with zero emissions, OK?

Cheerio,

Jagwire

I can't wait, the fuell cell scooter sounds even more exciting, I only hope they are reasonably priced.
As for the zero emissions, hopefully can just get some solar pannals, it doesn't sound like it uses much electricity. It even has power gain braking, which if it's what I am thinking when you apply the brakes some of the energy goes back into the battorie which is a great idea. I love the high performance I've never herd of a electric scooter so powerfull, wow! I can't wait!

Jeremiah Mondello
www.HydrogenPower.tk

Look at ecomoto.net - they sell electric vehicles and throw in green tags to offset the emmisions. I saw Evader scooter at the Indi dealer expo that are electric and reasonably priced. Current models top out at 30 MPH but they said they will have a 45 MPH+ model out in a few months. Don't know if it will be as fast as Vetrix but it should be a great alternative to gas scooters

Todd

I can see both sides of the argument with regards to 'is it zero emissions or not'.
I think the key point we're missing here is that, whilst we interested few know full well that zero emissions on any product, hydrogen cell or not, is never fully green (energy taken to to build fuel cells, windmills, solar cells etc), the majority of people can be easily fooled.
I don't have to conduct research, or read reports to know that not all Tuna fish is dolphin friendly. After the outcry, one supermarket labelled cans as 'Dolphin Friendly', then all the others followed suit within time.
So how are so many dolphins still being caught in nets, when the majority is supposedly dolphin friendly??

The general public in my opinion (and that includes us all), are all too easily fooled and/or too lazy to realise the meaning by a 'zero emissions' claim.

Therefore all I say is that the claim be made, but with clear explanation as to what it means in reality.

If you don't do this, public lethargy will slow the demand for better, and more efficient products, as they settle for something they believe is the perfect solution.

Cheers!

Some people believe we can have our cake and eat it. This is both greedy and naive. There is no perfect future where all 6billion + people have all the mod cons, which run on 100% clean energy. We won't even get close.

So before someone says, 'but we have to make these claims to make the bike more saleable', i.e. good publicity, we have to stop kidding ourselves, and wake up to the fact that we can't continue with all the glitz & glam, and flashy ads even if it is green.

The solution I'm afraid is less. We must consume less. Please dedicate time to creating more efficient vehicles, but we will run out of fuel and time before this ever has an effect. The focus must be on reduction, being less greedy.
Do I really need to make that trip to the store by car, just for a newspaper, and loaf of bread?

And so applying that to this scooter, it needs to be promoted for what it is, and what solution it provides. Not for how it looks, and how good you can feel about yourself by getting your bread with a scooter, rather than a 4x4. And we need to emphasise that it is a step in the right direction, but not the solution.

I hope these are philosophies inbuilt into the company, and not purely profit, or we're wasting our time.

Someone might say, 'at least they're doing something'. Think about the root causes of our energy problem: excessive wants, desires. But all this company might be doing is making people feel good about themselves. It's got to hit home with people at the heart.

People must WANT to change. They must be intuitive when it comes to eco issues. Not constantly educated by people like us on how to run an efficient lifestyle.

They need to know that the electricity they use to charge the bike is precious.

'It's the electric scooter to solve todays environmental & transport problems', says the website.

This is exactly what I meant. No it's not. It would better read: 'It's the electric scooter to HELP todays environmental & transport problems'

Less catchy, less flashy, but true. I've never been a big advocate of advertising!

They may lose out in sales, but they would have helped society a lot more............in my opinion

This website: http://www.electrictransport.net sells electric scooters and also offers renewable energy consulting services so that one day all vehicles are powered by renewable energy.

Pollution Free, Oil Free, It's Good To Be Free!TM

Dear Sir.

I would like to be your sales agent on your products.

Can you tell me more of your company and the possibility of this angency which i am applying.

Yours sincerely,

Mr.Valentine Mba.

in response to Jagwire,

a link to some of my own work featuring a car that I would drive to complement my desire to be totally "green" and fossil-fuel free:

http://www.designerspace.com/pages/3-designerspace/design/a/568/p/3/ntdd/0/m/5/portfolios.html

HAVE LARGE COMMERCIAL LOT ON HIGH TRAFFIC AREA IN HOUSTON NEXT TO MAJOR MAUL. I AM HIGHLY INTERESTED. THANKS

I gave up reading about half way down the page because people were arguing whether it was a green machine or not because the electricity that fuels it probably came from fosil fuels in the first place!

My point is this, everyone who is reading this now is doing so using electricty from whatever source it is produced.
Do the people who critisize the bike because it may still be using fosil fuels also critisize their computer and if so, please switch it off now!
Chris.

+i'm very interested in alternative vehicles, have you got a mailing list that i can be on?

I'm not trying to hound this company. I wish them ti succeed but they need to cater to not just the general public who want to drive vehicles exponentially like they do now, but feel good about it. They need to understand the real cot of electricity. It's about changing attitudes. I suggest those that don't agree notify the marketing dept to make suggestions (not be rude). I for one, will not buy one based on them destroying an argument environmentalists have been fighting for years: energy is NOT free: marketing@vectrixusa.com

I own two Oxygen (brand name) electric scooters and ride one to work almost every day, and for short trips whenever possible. Regardless of where the electricity comes from in San Diego, I am not burning up gasoline and not polluting the air with exhaust fumes and not disturbing the peace and quiet with loud ICE engine noise. I am also on the waiting list for a Vectrix. I think it is ironic and somewhat sad that on a website called Treehugger.com there is so much nit-picking and hair-splitting about this vehicle. No wonder the term Treehugger is such a perjorative! Talk is cheap. Put your money where your mouth is... Instead of preaching to the choir by posting here, do something pro-active in the real world, like buying an electric vehicle!

Is there any idea on the retail price of the vectrix?

With 2000 of our soldiers dead, not to mention all the Iraqi civilians, it seems as though the nay-sayers would at least consider that less oil is LESS OIL. And don't you think for one minute that we're over there to fight the war on terror. It's blood for oil Einstein.

Dear Sir or Madam,

I am going to buy electric scooter next month,
so let me know where I can find this type of el. scooter.

Best Regards,
Slavisa Zivadinovic

When I use to take chemistry class at college, one student ask jokingly if by "passing wind" or farting we were poluting, and the theacher said yes and explained the chemical contents that are gasified and released by billions of people each day... so concerning polution, I think we've heard enough comments about that and let's look forward to alternative solutions to make our planet greener... Vectrix is a nice way to go. I'am up for a purchase and retail distribution. I'am in Canada where electricity is still cheaper then any drop of gas!